G21/ZR450 at elevation

[kodiak]

I'm considering buying a new G21 and have a question that I can't seem to find the answer too.
Will a G21 equipped with a ZR 450 be enough power at an elevation of 6000 ft with the new 2.0:1 gear reduction transmission. I was told by the dealer that the 2013 G23 with the ZR450 at 6000 ft was under powered.

[nyryan2001]

^^^ apples to oranges false comparison..... this is why:

2013 450 Gs has the old tranny. OEM 2313 prop took 13-14 seconds to do 0-23mph with full OEM ballast. When you go above OEM ballast.... many would consider it lacking power.

2014 450 Gs have the new tranny and 17" prop. HUGE difference, faster 0-23mph under full ballast. we are hearing about 9 seconds form multiple sources. In comparison, 550s run it at about 7.5 seconds.

G21s are only 200lbs lighter than G23, so performance should be very similiar. so all things being equaly the g21 would do great with a 450 even going way above OEM ballast, satisfy 99% of folks.

But 6000ft elevation is tough. Its the loss of an engine upgrade in performace type of tough. I bet you loose these gains of the new tranny, and you will be at 13-14 seconds with a 450 G21 on the 17" prop and new tranny pulling 2850 OEM ballast.

So you have to make a decision. Do you want to go extreme with your ballast going 2-4k lbs above factory ballast? or do you usually stick to OEM ballast? is this your dream boat?

If you plan to stick mostly with OEM ballast, the 450 would be fine.

I will tell you to consider the XR550 if you run your boat hard and go heavy. not that much more of an upgrade. No one wants to drop $120k on a boat and get stuck when thet add the ballast they want.

Even better, get out on the water, sac it out and go heavy and see if the boat responds the way you want.

good luck.

[NautiqueJeff]

Here's some additional info...

I was in a G21 with the 343 a few weeks ago, and it performed fine, even with a load of people and full factory ballast. We pulled Murray and Bob Soven with that boat with no issues. This was at sea level though. It looks like the 450 at 6K would be about the same as a 343 at sea level.

[kodiak]

Thanks for the info. I always thought force induction engines had less HP loss at altitude, but they both lose around the same %.
The other issue I was concerned with was fuel consumption between the two.
Reason being is I spend about 3 weeks at lake Powell every year and there is only one marine that has premium fuel.
The houseboat has a 250 gallon toy tank but it contains only 87 octane.
I know both engines require premium, and I would have to bring about 30 gallons
of 98 and mix with the 87 to get about 70 gallons of 91.

[Zach@n3]

If the 550 were a turbo engine it would probably make up for the loss of atmosphere up there(to an extent). A supercharger has a set output based on its gearing so it only stands to reason that it would see close to an equal loss contrary to popular belief. A turbo can compensate using its waste gate unless the turbo is almost maxed out in its stock form (most aren't). At max set boost a turbo lets quite a bit of exhaust gas flow around the turbine housing to avoid an over boost or over spin situation. The waste gate actuator (unless computer controlled) operates on boost signal alone and would close the waste gate more if it didn't reach its target parameter. So the only advantage you will gain going with the 550 is the actual extra hp it makes just because its a higher hp engine from the get go.

[kodiak]

Thanks for the info Zah. That makes more sense to me now.

Just got an Email from customer.care@correctcraft.com.
Hello,

I spoke with the Chief Designer about your question. This is his response:

This is a somewhat difficult question to answer due to its subjective nature. How much power is enough? That depends on how a person desires to use their boat. I doubt that he will be able to fill factory ballast then put in a full capacity load of people and gear and get performance that he finds acceptable. If however, he is willing to reduce the load from what I described, either the ballast or people and gear, perhaps he will find it acceptable. One fact remains: at 6000 feet of elevation the sea level power of an engine with no supercharging will be decreased by approximately 20 percent. If I was buying a boat for usage at that altitude, I would do all I could to get the 550!

After reading this I will get the 550 if I go the new G21 route.

[NautiqueJeff]

I also rode in a G21 with the 550, and it was a rocket ship. That was at sea level too, though.

My 2013 G23 had the 550 as well, and it was awesome!

You'll LOVE the 550!

[Zach@n3]

I vote 550 G21=Hot Rod Boat.

[kodiak]

Put the deposit down, there is a chance I may be able to see it being built when I'm down in Orlando 3-24 thru 3-31. Needless to say my son and I are beyond excited.
Here is the build sheet.
http://www.designyournautique.com/de...6087CF95E6.pdf

[Zach@n3]

Congrats dude. The G21 has been a big hit at the show so far. First weekend and one already sold and numerous deal quotes out there. We take delivery of our second G21 this week.

[gchaney]

Put the deposit down, there is a chance I may be able to see it being built when I'm down in Orlando 3-24 thru 3-31. Needless to say my son and I are beyond excited.
Here is the build sheet.
http://www.designyournautique.com/de...6087CF95E6.pdf

If you don't mind about where did you end up on price and how much for deposit?

[kodiak]

1k deposit.

[gchaney]

is the price final what is on the product sheet or did you negotiate any. Sorry I am new to ordering a boat brand new and curious if there is anyplay in thosenumbers the dealers give you.

[Zach@n3]

There is always room for negotiation but it all depends on the dealer, time of year, floor boat, ordered boat, how long it's been there, how bad they want to sell it, etc. I also don't think most people are extremely comfortable with disclosing the pricing they paid for a large purchase on a public forum. It isn't a very gentlemanly gesture and isn't good for the community (dealers and customers) that may have a sale screwed up by a disclosed price or someone else may feel they got the shaft for the price paid if the disclosed price was a smoking deal that only comes along sometimes.

[gchaney]

Ok Thank you. I probably should just start a new thread just kind of trying to get a feel for how much boat I can afford. Sadly the "local" dealer 3 hours away only has 2 similarly equipped g23s and 2 similarly equipped 210 so I will likely be ordering one and the MSRP on the website doesn't help me much.