2014 G21 with <50h vs new 2015 Malibu 23LSV

[KTM525]

This weekend i was the first time on a newer boat with surf system, a G21. And no surprise, i liked the surfwake with stock ballast ;-).

Thats makes me again sleeping bad because of thinking of a new boat, like every year when the new boats are in the news. A used 2014 G21 NSS, white, <50h cost about the same like a new 2015 Malibu 23 LSV with surfgate, wedge, PnP.

Because its the end of the season.. what can you say about the 2014 G21

- did you have a lots of problems?
- how many houres?
- Is there something i should check in particular?
- would you buy it again?
- and maybe you have seen a 2015 23 LSV - your oppinion compared to your G21?

Of course i'm shure that both boats are a big step foreward from my 2008 Supra 21V, but they are also double the price i paid ;-), so it have to be.

Cheers, KTM525

[nyryan2001]

Ktm- talk specifics, what engines in the 2 boats?

[KTM525]

The G21 has the ZR 409 - the 23 LSV, at the same price, the 350, mabye the 6.0. My guess, with a LS3 the price of the Malibu will be higher.

[BTV]

Here are some thoughts from a nearly 50 year old who loves to wakeboard and surfs when the water is crap. I'm below average wakeboarder just wake to wake heel and toe and 180's. I don't try inverts anymore after a friend blew up his knee riding with me last summer. I don't want to do the same. So far from pro but good enough to appreciate a good wake.

I just traded out of a 2012 LSV with 350 to a G21 with the 409. I'm at nearly 4000' elevation and the 350 isn't enough in the LSV if you run over factory ballast to wakeboard. The LSV I was frustrated with time to plane if we ran much over factory ballast and forget using the wedge if over factory. I was nervous about the 409 having enough power, but it has been great. With full factory ballast and 1000# in bodies the G planes quickly and holds wakeboard speed easily.

Wakeboarding
I think the G21 wake is much better. It is much firmer than the LSV wake and a lot more fun to ride. The LSV wake I felt like I had to work for everything I got. The 21 just feels effortless to go big. The other huge thing is no extra ballast bags in the lockers or on the seats to get an unbelievable wake.

Surfing
I haven't surfed a 2014 or newer LSV with surfgate, but have surfed a 2013 LSV with SG. I think the G has bigger surf wake and NSS gives more adjustability to surf wake. Beginner surfers do have a harder time on the G because the wake is bigger and has so much push. Again no extra bags to deal with.

G has much better rough water ride.

The fit and finish of Nautique is hands down much better. It really is a night and day difference.

For our family the G21 has been amazing. It is so nice to just use factory ballast for anything we want to do. The seadek throughout boat is awesome. We haven't missed the extra length of a 23 foot boat, but we rarely have more than six people in the boat.

[nyryan2001]

KTM- I dont have a G21, but will provide some thoughts so you at least compare apples to apples.

Your gonna need to 450 in the 23LSV to compare powerwise to the 409hp G21. And the 409 G21 very well might outperform the 450 23LSV. The 17" prop on the G isnt just a little detail, its equivalent to 1-2 engine upgrades compared to a like powered 1:48 tranny on a 15" prop. Its a big deal.

So when you look at pricing and start to compare based on that, you gotta look at 450 23LSVs vs 409 G21s. A 409 G21 would straight stomp out a 350 23LSV just based on power performance alone. Cant compare them.

I have driven a bunch of the new boats. And this is what I will tell you, and thnk about your demos in these terms.... you need to schedule 1-2hr demos for both the G21 and the 23LSV. Bring with you, borrow or have the dealer bring three 1100 sacs with Tsunami pumps. one for each trunk and the bow. Skip this and you have a demo that isnt worth crap.

You need to spend a full hour driving, and the other hour as a pssenger and behind the boat. 2 HOURS!!!

spend 15-20 mins driving the boats are various speeds with no ballast. do you like it? its it awesome? is it comfy to drive?

Completely fill all ballast. Then fill your 3 1100s. then have at it. spend 30mins doing 19-23mph wake, and 30mins at 11.5mph surf. Are you impressed? Is the engine power adequate? Or is the saleman telling you about what he saw at a competition with a pro setup at some other time? ARE THE RESULTS THERE, AS IN, RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF YOU?? Reccomend you dont take his word for it what the boat is capable of that he saw somewhere else or about what he heard... make him SHOW YOU right there period.

YOU Drive the boat fully ballasted. is it comfy?? is it stil fun to drive? Would you want to drive the boat like that for 90mins - 2hrs at a time without a break? Do you have to contort your body up on the bolster? mirror easy to use? how bad is the bow rise?

[kodiak]

I have a G21 with the 550 with 90 hours on her and can't say enough good things about it. Now you guys are talking about loading it up with 3300 lbs + stock ballast (2800 lbs) + boat 5200lsb +gas ppl and gear lets say 700lbs. Your talking about 12000 lbs total. I just don't see how the 409 can handle that at wakeboard speeds. Would you have to be at WOT the whole time?

[shag]

Plus 1 for the G

[DLafont]

I'm guessing you're asking the same question to the Malibu fanatics and they're probably making similar arguments to what is being made here for that particular brand/model... Comes down to personal preference and budget, IMO. If you prefer the G and you can afford it, then go for it. If you prefer the Malibu and it's a better budgetary decision go for that. Either way, you'll be getting a great boat and will be able to have as much fun as you can on the water.

[KTM525]

i asked the same question in wakeworld, and i ask that question because i like both boats. Both have pro and cons and i'm try to get different opinions from you, things i don't know... ;-)

For example, i find linc 2.0 has a slow user interface and not so easy to use, i don't like the carpet everywhere in the malibu, i like the size of the LSV 23, and i do like the reverse seating option on the G.

Thanks to all the answers, all you input and experience is very welcome.

I do not care that much how the boat handles, as long as there is enough power to do the job, but i don't need more then enough power ;-).

[JoeA]

KTM

First of all this is a great scenario you have. I had a 2013 22MXZ and ran it for two years. Just sold it last weekend. I'm considering the G23, Supra SE and the new Mastercraft X23. I am not considering another Malibu. Why? The fit and finish is not as good as Nautique or MC. Quality control IMO is average at Malibu. MAlibus are very pleasing to the eye but you'll be making multiple trips to the dealer the first year for sure for warranty items. This is a well known fact so factor that in to your checklist.

Engines: It's also common knowledge that the LSV has a great wave for surfing BUT you will need the LS3 and the Acme 2315 prop to do what you want. Smaller engine and you'll be disappointed in the LSV. The G with a 2:1 tranny teamed up with the 409 is stout. Search YouTube for N3boatworks and G23 409 engine. You'll see a pair of G23s running up to wakeboard speeds. One has the 409 and the other has the 450......negligible difference reaching speed.

I'd go for the G21. Better reputation for fit, finish, and quality. I love the G series based on the massive amounts of storage. It's by far the leader in this boating category.

Do the test ride as suggested by NyRyan. Also look closely at how things fit in both boats. Ask yourself if you prefer hinged seats or not. Do you really want carpet lined walls under the seats? There's plenty of little things you'll notice in the G.

Good luck.

[josemolino]

I have done 80 hours in my 2014 G21 409 engine. No issues at all. It requires some extra weight on the port side to compensate propeller. I would buy it again and again until they create a better 21 footer. Unless you need space I would never go for a longer boat.
Wakeboard: No issue to plane at stock ballast with 12 people. I will never need more ballast so I would never buy a bigger engine (unless someone proves me that consumption is going to be better for a combined wake/surf use). The wake is big and hard enough for any trick. When NCSR at 5, pop is skyrocketing (even difficult to control in the beginning)
Surf Skimboard: NCRS 3 NSS 0, long and big . It pulls like crazy; in fact, I am using a real skimboard with a homemade fin that hardly floats.
Surf Surfboard: NCRS 5 NSS 3: it´s a wall...you can even create a tube...
I do not know about Malibu, but resale & quality wise I would take the G unless you really want to buy a brand new boat. (that will have 50 hours in 2 months time)

[KTM525]

what about a G21 with the 343HP Engine? Is that a absolutely no go, even when the price is nice? Stock Ballast and 8 Adults for Wakeboarding ans Wakesurfing.

[bsurfin]

Im all about the G boats but I recently surfed behind a 15 23LSV and it had the longest, tallest best surf wake I have been behind. I like the fit and finish of the G better then the LSV but with that being said I would buy the Malibu as the prices I got comparing new to new the LSV was $100k with the 6.0l and the G21 with the 409 was $115.

[Indy Rob]

I agree with Nyryan's Repsonse....spot on. I have the 409hp in my G23 (forsale on PN) and the power is unreal. I am in Indiana not at any elevation. With Full ballast, Full gas, and 5 people my G planes out in 6 seconds. Fuel economy is fantastic. We have averaged 6-7 gallons per hour (mostly wakeboarding). My neighbor has a 2013 LSV with the 343. With 1100's in the back and an addtional 400lbs in the front we can't plane out. If we throw 800lbs (vs only 400lbs) addtional in the front it will plane out. Then his boat looks like the Pro Wakeboard video's where wakesetter is graphic is under water and the driver better pay attention not to dip the nose. Incredible SurfWake on the LSV with just around 800lbs in the each of the back lockers and then another 400lbs in the front, especially the Starboard side. I feel so spoiled on G's not to loose storage in the back lockers. I have spent a solid amount of time in the G21 too. You can message me if you want more details -Rob

[hotrod508]

Definitely agree with indyrob on the plane times, I have witnessed the differences with the new 2:1 transmission. You really notice when you get back on a first year G23 that don't have the 2:1 drive! I think it's a must have/no brainer!