Terry McNew Leaving Correct Craft

[DRAGON88]

The vast majority of people in this country are CHRISTAINS. This country was founded on beliefs related to christainity. If someone, anyone is offended by that, get out. Majority rules.

Uh....

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Get out of what? Just because people don't agree with your personal beliefs they should have to "get out."

Ridiculous.

[ccskier16]

So....freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

[Rhode]

C'Mon SNMike, I know you can do better than errect straw men about God (whose?) and activist judges (whose?). At least tear them down like the conservative pundits do on FOX News.

And, me too about what Dragon said about the First Amendment. That's the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution in case you were wondering...

Rhode

[SNMike]

The vast majority of people in this country are CHRISTAINS. This country was founded on beliefs related to christainity. If someone, anyone is offended by that, get out. Majority rules.

Uh....

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Get out of what? Just because people don't agree with your personal beliefs they should have to "get out."

Ridiculous.

You missed the point sir. It's RIDICULOUS for one man in California to file a suit because he doesn't want his daughter to be forced to say "One nation under God"! in our pledge. Then DON'T say it. But "you're" not gonna change the pledge to suit 'you" because you're offended by the pledge as it's been writtten since day one. His right's are being trampled on???? I don't think so. No law says you have to say the pledge.

Again Dragon, my point is, "America, Love it or Leave It"!!
But don't try to undermine it. Just how can God offend anyone? You can't be offended by something you don't believe in, so the atheist's are covered.

BTW, I don't care what religion someone is, or even if they don't believe in God what so ever. As long as they do no harm, to me and my family, or you and your's.

Reagrds!! Mike

[DRAGON88]

I personally don't care one way or another, but I really do fail to see why god needs any mention in governmental dealing.

Actually the pledge of allegiance was amended to add the "under god." Wikipedia.org link.

I guess we both have different philosophies about America. I think that there is always room for improvement. I don't really see "God's" point in America's government. I'm not offended by it, but I also can see why someone would point out that it is superfluous to include "God".

[SNMike]

I personally don't care one way or another, but I really do fail to see why god needs any mention in governmental dealing.

Actually the pledge of allegiance was amended to add the "under god." Wikipedia.org link.

I guess we both have different philosophies about America. I think that there is always room for improvement. I don't really see "God's" point in America's government. I'm not offended by it, but I also can see why someone would point out that it is superfluous to include "God".

I know it was amended, but it was before I was born, so I make reference to it in my time. :grin:

I disagree with you, and you with me.
However, if you and your family ever end up on my doorstep in need of a meal, and a place to lay your head, you're covered!!

Regards!! Mike :grin:

[AbunDiga909]

If anyones seen Robin Williams Live on Broadway, you'll know his solution--"One nation, under Canada, above Mexico."

Just for the record, the only time I was "forced" to say the pledge of alegience was at some stupid camp a good 4-5 years ago, and even there they were totally cool with me saying or not saying any part of it. What I decided to say depended on how much sleep I got the previous night, nothing else, lol.

[redelf75]

niagara(sp): thank you, I accept your apology.

Rhode: Austin can visit you anytime!

SNMike: You’re right that the country was founded by Christians but our Country is based on no one religion and welcomes all and our Constitution backs this up. However, that being the case, I find it odd that God is in our Pledge, our money and even is in our courts. But when I go to Jury Duty, at least I’m given the option to say, “so help me God”. And you’re right that no one made or makes me say the Pledge, but I’m not sure what that says about my US Citizenship.

SGY: Now I think you're onto something, but…

All: I find this intense thread somewhat of an attack and I feel tired and don’t think an online forum is the way to discuss the matter – a bulletin board is great for some things but not this kind of communication. But one thing I would like to say is that it now appears that the tone of this thread has changed significantly for the better and I am glade to say that I still want to remain a PN member.

BKH: I know you’re monitoring this thread….you tend to chime in on most of the volatile discussions to add an objective view and some sense of order, in fact, I count on it. But this time you chose to stay out of it, other than a little side fact. You are a wise man and I probably should have followed your lead.

[bkhallpass]

Redelf,

I stayed out of this topic because I wanted to see how it might evolve. Religion is the most volitile topic on Earth. Throughout history, and even today, probably more people die over matters of religion than any other topic. It is extremely difficult to change another's mind, or even get them to look at another's perspective when it comes to matters of religion.

CC is a very Christian company. They make no applogies for it, and don't hide that fact. I'm not suggestion they should. It's just a fact. My observation is that PN is also a very Christian audience. Anyone who chooses to question how CCs leaders choose to practice Christianity is likely to meet with animosity, at least on this forum.

Austin seems to me a bright young man. He took a stand on something which was important to him. I too applaud his courage. However, he is still learning to understand an audience and to position his ideas such that others will consider them with an open mind. In time I'm sure he will become a very effective business man and negotiatior.

In the meantime, I would encourage anyone who took the time to read this thread to put yourself in the positon of Abundiga. Here is a 16 year old Jewish kid from NY. As near as I can tell he lives and breaths for Correct Craft and Nautiques. There's no doubt in my mind he daydreams about how cool it would be to work for Nautique some day. Maybe design boats; maybe own a distributorship; maybe even run the company. Then he reads a press release where it seems obvious that at CC, Christianity is important above all else- above profits, above industry expertise, above effectiveness in the job. He has to ask himself, would I ever have a chance at CC? Would they give me the opportunity? That's got to be a disappointing postion to be in. While he's at it, he would have to ask himself, how many other companies are out there where I might be denied opportunity just because I'm Jewish? In my mind, that a 16 year old American kid must be asking himself these types of question in 2006 is a dissappointing position for all of us.

In the end, I know it's a simple press release. It's true to form and consistent for CC and its family leadership who believe deeply in Christianity and their evangelism of the gospel. Still it raises interesting questions, that are worth looking at in an objective and reasonable manner.

BKH

[bkhallpass]

P.S. Sorry for my spelling errors. I typed this out very quickly. BKH

[redelf75]

THank you.

[DynaMike]

The bigger picture.

[OldFart]

As usual, i have to come in here & get you inbreds back on target (or kmart). more corporations need reputable businessmen of integrity, maybe from Enron or Duke's Lacrosse team

[wake-sk8]

Wow, this religion subject is really one to avoid eh ?? Personally, religion, colour etc. etc. doesn't matter. We are all one big loada folks living on the same planet (planet earth and planet nautique) and the world would be a better place if we all lived and got along together in harmony. That has to be the aim of any decent person in my book.

Anyways, here's a question - what will happen to the staff which McNew brought across from Sea Ray to CC. They were given some pretty high positions within CC. Are they gonna be 'poached' back again ??

Also, my thanks go to Terry for his input and being a nice guy. I was told by CC (and I think we've all noticed) that usually when someone goes CC 'clam up' and don't say a word. (A while ago we were all wondering what happened to Jeff Warner). Ken's comments were simply CC's way of showing their appreciation for Terry and to let him know that they also thought he was a great guy.

[ag4ever]

In the meantime, I would encourage anyone who took the time to read this thread to put yourself in the positon of Abundiga. Here is a 16 year old Jewish kid from NY. As near as I can tell he lives and breaths for Correct Craft and Nautiques. There's no doubt in my mind he daydreams about how cool it would be to work for Nautique some day. Maybe design boats; maybe own a distributorship; maybe even run the company. Then he reads a press release where it seems obvious that at CC, Christianity is important above all else- above profits, above industry expertise, above effectiveness in the job. He has to ask himself, would I ever have a chance at CC? Would they give me the opportunity? That's got to be a disappointing postion to be in. While he's at it, he would have to ask himself, how many other companies are out there where I might be denied opportunity just because I'm Jewish? In my mind, that a 16 year old American kid must be asking himself these types of question in 2006 is a dissappointing position for all of us.

I think bkhallpass just hit the nail on the head, but looking at it from the company's stand point, they are free to hire and promote whomever they wish. They might be passing up better qualified persons with their "exterior" requirements, but they still have the right as a "private" company. I am sure there are plenty of other companies that hire based on religion and (gasp) race, but the fact of the matter is we are all human and not infallable. If this is the lesson that austin has learned at that young age, he is miles ahead of most others.