LONG many questions '14 G21 Upgrade? G21 vs G23, Older/ Newer/New Other Boats? Supra?

[dscayenne11]

Sorry for such a long post. I keep trying to find these answers and get close but not close enough.


New guy here so thanks in advance for the feedback... I have, probably like many of us on here, read and read many articles/posts and see many of my questions closely answered but some of the answers or feedback are not exact to what my questions are.

My goal is to figure out what new boat to buy- and maybe related Why is Nautique "the best" I have some experience and ideas but there are some new boats out there that seem nice, and are for sure less expensive.

We are a younger family---really enjoy surfing, my oldest is 7, then 5, then 2 and they love being on the water, surfing and wakeboarding is for sure in just around the corner for them. Us adults are just out having a good time, being mom and dad when we are with the kiddos and then we do some adults only surf outings, none of us are great, but starting to think about spins, etc.

Background..My brother in law has had a 2015 G23, 2016 G23 and now has a 2018 G23.

• 1995 Ski Closed Bow
• 1998 Air
• 1996 SAN
• 2001 SAN
• 2007 236
• 2012 230
• 2015 G23
• 2016 G23
• 2018 G23

My first boat was a 2005 226, now I own a 2014 G21.

Needless to say we are a die hard Nautique family, but aside from my two boats I was not the buyer, and rather just the little bro in law who tagged along on some nice boats.

When I bought my first 226 I had a 2 year old and new I wanted family time, didn't need top of the line/new and surfing was just catching on. I bought a 226 knowing it was a cross over with a deeper hull. When I went to buy my 2014 G21 I was planning on buying a 2012 230, they got the G21 in the night before, loved the colors, loved the big motor since the 226 I felt struggled (motor size is a question below) so I bought it. I have owned the 2014 G21 for just over 2 years, bought it June of 2017.


A good friend just bought a 2019 Supra SL 450, wife rode it and said she would give me permission to go buy the Supra tomorrow...said she loved it.

So here are my questions....Even though my brother in law owns and has owned G23s i have never surfed one, seems silly but we just live separate/busy lives.

First Topic-I am comparing a 2014 boat (regardless of brand) to a 2019 boat, being the friends Supra.

• Issue/Question about my boat vs supra (or newer boat)
  • My throttle is "firm"- having never driven other boats I would have never complained, but driving the 2019 Supra it was very smooth from "0% barely moving forward up to say 75% throttle pulling someone up, and then again back down. One thing I would say about my boat is the first say 1" of movement is sort of like, "nothing, nothing, nothing, and bam 10% throttle". Maybe not 10% but it is for sure not as smooth as the 2019 Supra...I noticed it right away, especially smooth when trailering the boat. I feel with my boat, i throttle up, again maybe its not 10% when it engages as if if "jumps" forward but then I back it down to go "extra slow".

1. So my questions- Does this sound familiar to others? Meaning a firm throttle.
2. Do newer Gs have the same throttle feel? I believe I was told something about Throttle by Wire in my boat vs what I think I understood something else in newer boats?
3. Same for my steering wheel, I am not breaking a sweat turning my steering wheel but it was a dramatic difference on the Supra. Is there maybe an assisted steering on newer boats?
4. I also noticed the Supra cut through rollers/rough water better, I am pretty sure this is simply because it is a bigger boat? can anyone confirm? or is there something different about a Supra Hull? what about the newer nautique?

Second Topic-Surf Wave- Steep on G21 vs Longer on Supra? OR 21 foot boat vs 24 foot boat regardless of brand

• As I said above I am not a pro surfer, and also I am more of a buy and use person so my setup may make a difference which I have been reading about more after riding the supra.
• I surf at 11.6 (goofy side) all tanks 100% full.
• I have 150 lbs of lead on each of the left and right of the bow storage so 300 total in the bow.
• I have 100 on the port (left/passenger) side mid ship in the front of the under seat storage and 150 on the starboard (right/driver) side mid ship. The extra 50 is to account for prop wash on the goofy side.
• I have 300 at the very front of both rear storage lockers.
• Total weight 1150 lbs plus the stock ballast of the 2,850 +/-
• NCRS at 0, NOT ENGAGED (steeper wave) and NSS at ) fully engaged (steeper wave)

After owning this boat for 2 years, I fully admit I have tried many settings and keep landing back at NCRS and NSS both at 0. In the last 2-3 weeks I am reading and now wondering if i have my setup wrong. I say this because after riding the supra the wave is for sure longer and has more push.

There are many variables here between the boats and set up. But both my wife and I said the same thing about the Supra wave, which was it was a different feel being longer and had more push.

Question/Opinion/Experience-

• Does it seem like I have to much weight in the back of my boat, which is a short boat comparatively speaking therefore my wave is tall but steep?
• With that question said...I have read a few things, one being that "a G21 has two options for the wave, steep and steeper" the other is that in general the entire G series is known for a steeper taller wave.

Third Topic- My older Nautique VS Newer Nautique NCRS, NSS, Computer/Screen

• Knowing I have a good amount of weight in the back of my boat, planing has been in the front of my mind. I have the 550 hp motor but I still have always thought my boat didn't plane very well. I seem to drive in one of the user settings, " User Name, Dustin, Brittany etc." or Back to Dock. Regardless of the user setting I thought NCRS was automatic except while NSS was engaged. This 4th of July I was tubing with a full boat of people, empty tanks though and started playing with the NCRS intensity setting low/high and Auto and maybe realized I had something wrong for the past couple years.
• I understand the new hull on the G23, 2016 and after, makes a big difference? Does anyone know or can explain what the difference in the hull does? Better/Bigger wave? Smoother Drive? Better in Rough Water?
• I am told the NCRS/NSS is improved from 2014. How so? what does it change? any specifics? Like maybe the older boats NSS extended 2 inches and the newer boats extend 2.5", just an example.
• With the questions about planing, hull design, and ncrs i then wonder if the bigger motor is needed? I do 1 maybe 2 weekends a year in higher elevation so i do not need it for that reason. But if a 450 motor is perfect then it also changes the price point of the boat i would need to consider.

Maybe its not as easy as that but just a combination of effects between all of the changes.


I am not sure I am asking all of this the right way but I am hoping it makes sense and some of you can help me understand the differences between a newer Nautique or just simply a newer boat regardless of brand.

Fit and Finish is known- I saw that first hand and I am not knocking a Supra, but its not close to the level of detail of a Nautique. With that said, I have to decided if the changes between my 2014 and a new or newer G23 will solve some of my issues, #1 better drive/smoother, #2 Wave Steep/Long, #3 newer software/technology. I also have not had a chance to go out in 2 weeks to make some changes to weight placement and see the results. I am planning on selling my G21 because I think a newer one will be better but I am also not wanting to fork out another $50-75K after selling my boat just because its newer so I am hoping for some solid info on what the newer boats provide compared to the older boats.


I am planning to test drive the following, any input would be great

• Malibu I think MXZ 24, but maybe the 23 LSV
• Mastercraft X24
• Nautique G23 Maybe a G25

thank you very much!

[nohlan_4]

New G's all have throttle by wire and they are very smooth feeling. I don't see there being much difference with the Supra. Some new boats have a hydraulic assist on the steering.
I dont find it that noticeable though, whens the last time you oiled your steering cable and greased your rudder box on your boat?

Not super familiar with the Supra hull but being good or bad in rough water is the way the hull is shaped. I don't find my G23 bad at all but my lake maybe gets windy enough for 1.5' rollers at max so nothing too crazy.

I would say add the 150 on the port side and move the 100 to the star mid ship. Also try listing the boat to the surf side abit by dropping 50% out of the non surfside factory ballast. This is how I surf my boat and its awesome. Also NCRS and NSS at 0 mean the most mellow (not steep) wave you can get. Your setup is pretty close to what I have in my G23 actually. If this wave it still too steep. Trying running up to 11.8 mph should length the wave some. Or take 50 pounds out of each rear locker and add both to the front bow area.

The new hull design is just to the NSS running surface alone nothing else on the hull has changed. I personally don't feel the changes were huge other than the fact that the new boats new less extra ballast to make a good wave and they don't need to be listed at all. Rough water ride will be the same except the new hull has deflectors to deflect spray away from the cabin on windy days that's it. Plus all the tech add ons as well but you can read the specs on those anywhere.

[dscayenne11]

nohlan_4

Thanks for the feedback. Right there shows my lack of what i have in regards to the NCRS/NSS settings. I thought 0/0 made the wave as short length wise and taller height wise. That sort of explains why when i played with the settings moving them up while my wife was riding she lost push and went down. I was expecting the wave to lengthen giving her more push further back, instead it was the exact opposite and I just didn't realize it.

Looks like I have some configuring to change around. Thanks again

[nohlan_4]

nohlan_4

Thanks for the feedback. Right there shows my lack of what i have in regards to the NCRS/NSS settings. I thought 0/0 made the wave as short length wise and taller height wise. That sort of explains why when i played with the settings moving them up while my wife was riding she lost push and went down. I was expecting the wave to lengthen giving her more push further back, instead it was the exact opposite and I just didn't realize it.

Looks like I have some configuring to change around. Thanks again

Those settings dont really have anything to do with the length of wave. More so the shape. Higher numbers equal steeper wave shape and more lip. Smaller numbers are less steep and less lip.

[Adrenaline1]

My 2019 GS22 has less than desirable throttle response and will be looked at when it goes in. It is exactly how you described. It seems like it engages fine, then nothing, nothing, nothing, GO! (seems like 2 inches or more of throttle movement with no response, I will try to measure it next time out tomorrow) I do not know if there is a way to adjust it or not, but I expect better for the price for sure. I will keep you posted on that. Maybe someone here knows more on the subject.

[99bison]

21 is going to be shorter wave no matter the brand than a 23 or 24.

G21 is known to be on steep/shorter side persay. 16 G23 was hull change, no hull changes for G21.

Generally for all boats add weight to front (or drop from back) for longer (and shorter) wave.

NSS 0, I havenÂ’t figured out a use case for making this any thing else yet (maybe to reduce the wave size and push if thats desired)

NCRS 5 will make steeper wave

NCRS 0 will make flatter wave.

—-
IMHO:

Lots of the other misc “stuff” your referencing is a 19 vs 14 boat thing.

New G23 will be different than your 14 G21. As will all the other bigger boats.

What dealer(s) you prefer to work with on the service front?

Assuming surfing 90% of the time there are lots of great options.

As everyone will say demo all you can, of course quality of demo can vary greatly but at least you get an idea.

[99bison]

My 2019 GS22 has less than desirable throttle response and will be looked at when it goes in. It is exactly how you described. It seems like it engages fine, then nothing, nothing, nothing, GO! (seems like 2 inches or more of throttle movement with no response, I will try to measure it next time out tomorrow) I do not know if there is a way to adjust it or not, but I expect better for the price for sure. I will keep you posted on that. Maybe someone here knows more on the subject.

Sounds like throttle is messed up somehow unless gs isn’t by wire?

[kylant]

my throttle on my '19 GS22 is smooth as silk. very responsive. steering is also very smooth.

Go down to Superior and demo a G23, then go elsewhere and demo others.