Buyers Market & Prices Increases

[Phil8uga]

Just curious others thoughts on when it will be a buyers market OR when new boat price increases will stop??? New boat prices have risen every year for at least the past 7 years. When do the prices increases stop? OR do banks start offering 30 year loans so the boat mfg.'s can continue to increase prices?

[NautiqueJeff]

I don't see it stopping anytime soon. Nautique sold out of 2021 boats for many of their models already, so demand is still very high, even at today's prices.

[shag]

I see things slowing later this year, if the economy falters...

[Phil8uga]

I agree Jeff..... I think 2021 will be another great year for anyone selling a boat. With supply catching up with demand it will be interesting to watch 2022. Although i do think 2022 should be a good year too, BUT I am curious when will be the first year of NO price increases.

[GMLIII]

Hate to be negative but if increase legislative wakesurf restrictions get imposed which I see likely in the future, the bottom is going to drop out of the wake boat industry as a whole and drastically reducing the value of these boat significantly. At that point the price of these boats will drop, IMHO.

[Nautiquehunter]

Our new prez wants to spend 2 trillion for a stimulus . I see hyperinflation and high energy cost in the near future . It won't lower the price but it will slow down sales?

[bturner]

With the exception of Vid pandemic type events (which is a first for me) the sales and pricing of boats like most luxury items tend to follow the market. Sure you'll see some of the lower end of the market slow down with energy prices but for people with expendable incomes paying another $1000/yr for gas won't stop them from being on the water. This is true all the way to the point of a melt down like in 2008 where everyone took a bath. I was lucky enough to have a steady job, without fear of losing it at the time and cleaned up on a 2 yo boat for about 2/3 it's going price just a year before. I basically bought it for what the PO had left on the loan.

Trying to leave politics out of it (if that's possible) and just focusing on policy, I think the above statements are pretty spot on. Going deep into the red to hand out freshly printed money without oversight, handing out $50K student debt forgiveness for every idiot that financed a useless college degree and enacting energy policies that will undoubtedly kill jobs and drastically increase energy prices (I'm thinking $3/gallon by September) will collapse the once booming economy. The script never changes and once again the effect will be felt most on the poor and middle class. There is no such thing as free money and there are not enough rich people to tax to pay for all this. Taxes are going to be raised significantly (which the current president promised on the campaign trail) on everything petroleum related which will include all the unintended (well maybe unintended) products which includes fiberglass and vinyl. But none of this should be a surprise as Joe clearly stated what he was going to do and is moving quickly to do so with dictator like fashion with executive orders bypassing congress and any resemblance of democratic procedure in the process.

The result of all this (IMO) will be that the middle class will struggle with day to day bills and will be the first to leave the boating market. With inboard this in most cases is in the 2 - 4 yo used market. The upper middle class and rich will be much less affected ( will probably have to cut down on their Grey Poupon) but with the used market falling apart they'll be no one to buy their used boats. Once the boat buying food chain crumbles at the bottom the market will fall apart at the top as well. Prices on top end luxury items like boats rarely tumbles but instead what you'll see is "value" boats and content removed boats with bigger discounts as companies try to keep production rolling at some level.Still this will put downward pressure on the market from top to bottom and you'll have your buyer's market for anyone left that can be in it.

All doom and gloom I know but being older than dirt I've seen this cycle at least 3 times.The good news is that once people start feeling the effects of all these nonsense garbage policies things tend to change and the balance is once again restored. Unfortunately this can take time which in our case now at least 2 years and possibly 4 to overturn executive orders that IMO will kill boating off to one degree or another.

Which keeps me thinking this is the time to sell and get that Vid money out of my boat. It it wasn't for the fact that'll we'll be locked down at least through July (once again IMO) and the kids would kill me for selling the boat, I'd have it on the market the first week of March.

In closing I'd like to apologize for the rant. The endless hours doing nothing due to our lock downs (still no bowling) and lack of Ammo (can't go shooting) have kept me from any form of outside activity distractions I typically have to keep me sane in the winter up here. And who knows, maybe these are all really good policies being implement by the power of the pen and I'm completely wrong. Nah.... probably not.

[Jph3]

Unfortunately, you are spot on... this feels all too familiar. It wasnt that long ago I was thinking a new $50k boat was expensive.

[Nautiquehunter]

With the exception of Vid pandemic type events (which is a first for me) the sales and pricing of boats like most luxury items tend to follow the market. Sure you'll see some of the lower end of the market slow down with energy prices but for people with expendable incomes paying another $1000/yr for gas won't stop them from being on the water. This is true all the way to the point of a melt down like in 2008 where everyone took a bath. I was lucky enough to have a steady job, without fear of losing it at the time and cleaned up on a 2 yo boat for about 2/3 it's going price just a year before. I basically bought it for what the PO had left on the loan.

Trying to leave politics out of it (if that's possible) and just focusing on policy, I think the above statements are pretty spot on. Going deep into the red to hand out freshly printed money without oversight, handing out $50K student debt forgiveness for every idiot that financed a useless college degree and enacting energy policies that will undoubtedly kill jobs and drastically increase energy prices (I'm thinking $3/gallon by September) will collapse the once booming economy. The script never changes and once again the effect will be felt most on the poor and middle class. There is no such thing as free money and there are not enough rich people to tax to pay for all this. Taxes are going to be raised significantly (which the current president promised on the campaign trail) on everything petroleum related which will include all the unintended (well maybe unintended) products which includes fiberglass and vinyl. But none of this should be a surprise as Joe clearly stated what he was going to do and is moving quickly to do so with dictator like fashion with executive orders bypassing congress and any resemblance of democratic procedure in the process.

The result of all this (IMO) will be that the middle class will struggle with day to day bills and will be the first to leave the boating market. With inboard this in most cases is in the 2 - 4 yo used market. The upper middle class and rich will be much less affected ( will probably have to cut down on their Grey Poupon) but with the used market falling apart they'll be no one to buy their used boats. Once the boat buying food chain crumbles at the bottom the market will fall apart at the top as well. Prices on top end luxury items like boats rarely tumbles but instead what you'll see is "value" boats and content removed boats with bigger discounts as companies try to keep production rolling at some level.Still this will put downward pressure on the market from top to bottom and you'll have your buyer's market for anyone left that can be in it.

All doom and gloom I know but being older than dirt I've seen this cycle at least 3 times.The good news is that once people start feeling the effects of all these nonsense garbage policies things tend to change and the balance is once again restored. Unfortunately this can take time which in our case now at least 2 years and possibly 4 to overturn executive orders that IMO will kill boating off to one degree or another.

Which keeps me thinking this is the time to sell and get that Vid money out of my boat. It it wasn't for the fact that'll we'll be locked down at least through July (once again IMO) and the kids would kill me for selling the boat, I'd have it on the market the first week of March.

In closing I'd like to apologize for the rant. The endless hours doing nothing due to our lock downs (still no bowling) and lack of Ammo (can't go shooting) have kept me from any form of outside activity distractions I typically have to keep me sane in the winter up here. And who knows, maybe these are all really good policies being implement by the power of the pen and I'm completely wrong. Nah.... probably not.

What he said.

[RDT-G23]

Hate to be negative but if increase legislative wakesurf restrictions get imposed which I see likely in the future, the bottom is going to drop out of the wake boat industry as a whole and drastically reducing the value of these boat significantly. At that point the price of these boats will drop, IMHO.

I agree, with a significant caveat:

I have followed the thread on this topic as it relates the what is (or has) happened in Virginia. While I don't think this is an isolated legislative effort, I don't see a boom with related efforts, and even fewer that will be sucessful. Certainly, anything is possible-I don't deny. I just don't think we will see an effort that sweeps the country in the next 5, possbly 10 years. While I don't work in the boating business, my resposbilities in my own industry include legislative and regulatory affairs for Texas and Oklahoma (the geography my buisness units operate in) As such, I have governement affairs, and contract lobbyists under my direction. We see nothing like this, not to say it couldn't rear it's head. (That said, both of my states are quite conservative-and would be reluctant to push this kind of thing in any event. There are just too many other issues in front of these two legislatures, in my opinion. Again, this is my perspective from Texas/OK - and my dialogue here likely belongs on that other thread!

[GMLIII]

I agree, with a significant caveat:

I have followed the thread on this topic as it relates the what is (or has) happened in Virginia. While I don't think this is an isolated legislative effort, I don't see a boom with related efforts, and even fewer that will be sucessful. Certainly, anything is possible-I don't deny. I just don't think we will see an effort that sweeps the country in the next 5, possbly 10 years. While I don't work in the boating business, my resposbilities in my own industry include legislative and regulatory affairs for Texas and Oklahoma (the geography my buisness units operate in) As such, I have governement affairs, and contract lobbyists under my direction. We see nothing like this, not to say it couldn't rear it's head. (That said, both of my states are quite conservative-and would be reluctant to push this kind of thing in any event. There are just too many other issues in front of these two legislatures, in my opinion. Again, this is my perspective from Texas/OK - and my dialogue here likely belongs on that other thread!

Ironically the two Virginia delegates that tried to push the wakesurfing restriction bill through were both Republicans, go figure in a predominantly Blue state. In this case the Democrats helped defeat the proposed bill

[Wayward]

With the exception of Vid pandemic type events (which is a first for me) the sales and pricing of boats like most luxury items tend to follow the market. Sure you'll see some of the lower end of the market slow down with energy prices but for people with expendable incomes paying another $1000/yr for gas won't stop them from being on the water. This is true all the way to the point of a melt down like in 2008 where everyone took a bath. I was lucky enough to have a steady job, without fear of losing it at the time and cleaned up on a 2 yo boat for about 2/3 it's going price just a year before. I basically bought it for what the PO had left on the loan.

Trying to leave politics out of it (if that's possible) and just focusing on policy, I think the above statements are pretty spot on. Going deep into the red to hand out freshly printed money without oversight, handing out $50K student debt forgiveness for every idiot that financed a useless college degree and enacting energy policies that will undoubtedly kill jobs and drastically increase energy prices (I'm thinking $3/gallon by September) will collapse the once booming economy. The script never changes and once again the effect will be felt most on the poor and middle class. There is no such thing as free money and there are not enough rich people to tax to pay for all this. Taxes are going to be raised significantly (which the current president promised on the campaign trail) on everything petroleum related which will include all the unintended (well maybe unintended) products which includes fiberglass and vinyl. But none of this should be a surprise as Joe clearly stated what he was going to do and is moving quickly to do so with dictator like fashion with executive orders bypassing congress and any resemblance of democratic procedure in the process.

The result of all this (IMO) will be that the middle class will struggle with day to day bills and will be the first to leave the boating market. With inboard this in most cases is in the 2 - 4 yo used market. The upper middle class and rich will be much less affected ( will probably have to cut down on their Grey Poupon) but with the used market falling apart they'll be no one to buy their used boats. Once the boat buying food chain crumbles at the bottom the market will fall apart at the top as well. Prices on top end luxury items like boats rarely tumbles but instead what you'll see is "value" boats and content removed boats with bigger discounts as companies try to keep production rolling at some level.Still this will put downward pressure on the market from top to bottom and you'll have your buyer's market for anyone left that can be in it.

All doom and gloom I know but being older than dirt I've seen this cycle at least 3 times.The good news is that once people start feeling the effects of all these nonsense garbage policies things tend to change and the balance is once again restored. Unfortunately this can take time which in our case now at least 2 years and possibly 4 to overturn executive orders that IMO will kill boating off to one degree or another.

Which keeps me thinking this is the time to sell and get that Vid money out of my boat. It it wasn't for the fact that'll we'll be locked down at least through July (once again IMO) and the kids would kill me for selling the boat, I'd have it on the market the first week of March.

In closing I'd like to apologize for the rant. The endless hours doing nothing due to our lock downs (still no bowling) and lack of Ammo (can't go shooting) have kept me from any form of outside activity distractions I typically have to keep me sane in the winter up here. And who knows, maybe these are all really good policies being implement by the power of the pen and I'm completely wrong. Nah.... probably not.

I remember these exact same things being said about the same policies, same executive orders, and same type of thinking during the Obama administration........ And while that thinking would seem to make sense to me, that isn't at all what we saw.

While we could guess the new administrations policies could hinder economic growth, and slow the boat market.......... I'm not so sure I would bet on it. Especially considering it is going to take a couple years just to get dealer inventories back to healthy. This is not a guess at this point. Most manufacturers are close to fully booked for production through this year, and that production doesn't include any boats for inventory health. They are barely covering the customer orders (and aren't able to even do that in a some cases.) Inventories will be low until at least fall of 2022, even if the market slowed a bit. I wouldn't expect a "buyers market" anytime soon, unless we have Wall Street or Big Banking make another major mistake (which certainly isnt out of the realm of possibilities).

[swc5150]

Ha I remember thinking the boat market was toast when the Ski Nautique hit the $30k mark.

[GMLIII]

Ha I remember thinking the boat market was toast when the Ski Nautique hit the $30k mark.

Many on this forum may be back in the Ski Nautique market once again for a $100,000 plus and thinking they got a good deal after dumping their G boats at $200,000 plus if wakesufing gets highly regulated from our legislators around the country.

[Phil8uga]

I believe the banks are drivng the boom. i would imagine 80% of new and used boats putchased are financed. could you magine if they changed lending practice and only offered 10 or 15 year loans? Or let's flip the scenario........ what if the banking industry starts to allow 25 or 30 year loans. We will see these boats reach +$400K and above.