Nautique PLEASE READ!

[greggmck]

Also consider there may be no correlation whatsoever to the supplemental ballast and the new screen hardware? The screen vendor could have come out with a newer model that was more reliable and lower cost, but not completely software compatible with prior generations. The display market for boats is not like Apple. High-volume software like that on phones can be designed to detect all known hardware configurations and apply specific updates to the appropriate hardware, all in the same software build. This is beneficial for Apple and other high volume device makers. But designing such software is complex and requires extensive testing on all prior generation hardware (also expensive). It is unreasonable to expect Nautique software engineers to introduce this level of complexity to software that runs a few hundred to a thousand boats.

[srock]

Friend's Caddy Escalades have video at the mirrors and its pretty cool and can provide additional views that a normal mirror cannot. Some planes do the same in their windows. However, I am in agreement with many that a plain old tech mirror is the right way to go if you want to avoid menus and problems. The only way I would do a screen-mirror is if it was its own stand alone system so I could throw it out if it did no perform perfectly. I just want to ride without the hassles...I can mess with tech stuff while sitting on my couch.

[Tchur1]

Friend's Caddy Escalades have video at the mirrors and its pretty cool and can provide additional views that a normal mirror cannot. Some planes do the same in their windows. However, I am in agreement with many that a plain old tech mirror is the right way to go if you want to avoid menus and problems. The only way I would do a screen-mirror is if it was its own stand alone system so I could throw it out if it did no perform perfectly. I just want to ride without the hassles...I can mess with tech stuff while sitting on my couch.

Not trying to push other brands, this is one feature I do really like about the X-Star though. The rear facing camera lives in the center of the vitals screen that doesn't interfere with any other systems on the boat, and I can get toggle it on and off with 1 click of a hard button on the dash. With the 2 screens in the paragon I wonder if Nautique can design something similar.

[Cpan13]

Yes. But I pay for the screens on a premium boat to be able to use them. Does your car come with a backup camera? Why on earth would you want that when you have a mirror? Really?

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Not quite the same. A boat has almost zero obstructions for your line of sight, where as a car or truck has a lot. For instance I use my backup camera religiously in my F350 but have absolutely zero use for one in my 79 Bronco with no roof, because I can just see everything with my own eyes.

I totally understand owning a premium boat and expecting things to function like you want them to, but labeling this as a safety concern because you can’t see other boats or jet skis behind you is laughable.

[bird_dog0347]

Not quite the same. A boat has almost zero obstructions for your line of sight, where as a car or truck has a lot. For instance I use my backup camera religiously in my F350 but have absolutely zero use for one in my 79 Bronco with no roof, because I can just see everything with my own eyes.

I totally understand owning a premium boat and expecting things to function like you want them to, but labeling this as a safety concern because you can’t see other boats or jet skis behind you is laughable.

I get that this is a first world problem for sure, but when I have people sitting on the lounge chairs on the stern, it does make it difficult to see behind me easily with the mirror or just by looking and thus the camera mounted up high provides a much better view, so yes, safety.

[greggmck]

Not quite the same. A boat has almost zero obstructions for your line of sight, where as a car or truck has a lot. For instance I use my backup camera religiously in my F350 but have absolutely zero use for one in my 79 Bronco with no roof, because I can just see everything with my own eyes.

I totally understand owning a premium boat and expecting things to function like you want them to, but labeling this as a safety concern because you can’t see other boats or jet skis behind you is laughable.

I never said I can't see other boats behind me. I said in the context of the rear view camera that it no longer will show other boats approaching so why limits its view? When you spend the time in a boat and use its features they become part of the experience. We always surf with the camera on full view because it provides information about the surfer and the area behind them and becomes part of an instrument scan. I can see when my rider immediately falls while looking at my instruments and not at the mirror. I can also see fast approaching boats or jet skis in that view too. I add the mirror to my scan when needed but the dash and windshield scans are much more convenient and I expect the rear camera to work in a high-end boat such as a Paragon.

[Neptune442]

That is extremely strange that you can't configure/customize the screen and camera angles exactly how you want. Obviously everyone is going to have their own unique preferences and opinions of what information is important to them. Seems like a no brainer.

[greggmck]

It is common to have a high degree of software configurability in our cars and personal devices but I think that level of configurability and customization is far beyond the existing software capability used by Nautique.

[srock]

It is common to have a high degree of software configurability in our cars and personal devices but I think that level of configurability and customization is far beyond the existing software capability used by Nautique.

The market is not as scalable as others. I wonder why tow boats are not using NEMA protocols.

[Nautiquehunter]

We get it. You're a luddite and/or a tech laggard. Not every is....

Probably true?

[SmokieRiver]

Is this just a Paragon software update or is it impacting the G23 also? My G is at the dealer right now for 20 hour service and hopefully I don’t lose the GoPro or cropping of the awareness camera.

[scottb7]

I just hope you get the volume of support necessary to get their attention. What I have bumped up against in these situations is that the internal culture and support of staff decision making is tough to overcome. In other words, someone is going to claim that before they made the change they did a survey and most people liked it and so on. And their boss going to say yah, we checked it out, and look ### of posts and like one or two don't like it.

A lack of organizational humility, an inability to put your concern in context to the cost of the boat, and a culture of hubris (excessive pride or self-confidence)...

For every customer complaint there are 26 other unhappy customers who have remained silent –Lee Resource.

[greggmck]

Is this just a Paragon software update or is it impacting the G23 also? My G is at the dealer right now for 20 hour service and hopefully I don’t lose the GoPro or cropping of the awareness camera.

I can't believe they would cripple the GoPro on the Paragon but keep in on the G? The update may be staged in time because of testing but I suspect it is coming to a G near you.

[99bison]

There’s a new open and actually supported api for go pro just released a few weeks back. Likely the integration will be changed to that… so it’s more reliable. Also will also likely require newer cameras or software updates to existing of gopro will have them for earlier cameras.

[bturner]

We get it. You're a luddite and/or a tech laggard. Not every is....

Interesting insult you throw out there.

While I find some of the technical innovations being implemented in boats today useful I honestly don't think having a concern about technology for technology's sake makes you a luddite or tech laggard. There isn't a single board out there that doesn't have a story about issues with firmware, $5K screens needing to be replaced, LED cup holders starting on fire or systems failing due to some over complicated system of poor design. Just because something is new doesn't make it good. In IT we call this the bleeding edge for a reason and it looks to me like there may be a bit of bleeding going on here.

As to the firmware upgrade..... Having been a data center manager and now a system engineer for a server manufacture I will tell you straight up you won't last long in IT blindly updating firmware (you will however get to spend long nights in the data center trying to un-F the mess you made). You learn very quickly (as it would appear the OP has) that you really need to know exactly what you're getting before implementing the latest firmware code drop. As someone that has been at ground zero for my share of failed firmware implementations (see the above comment about long nights in the data center) I can tell you first hand that we only recommend a firmware upgrade after extensive research, testing and most importantly only if it addresses a specific issue you are having or adds a specific feature you need. Unfortunately it's been my experience that most firmware updates will fix one issue but all too often have undesirable consequences in other areas which seems the case here.

Depending on how the firmware was written (and/or the level of support you have from those who wrote it) the good news is that you should be able to back level the firmware although some developers make this more difficult than is necessary. Well thought out systems (mostly routers and higher end servers) will retain multiple copies of the firmware within the system but I'm not aware of this feature in the systems implemented in the boating industry. One of the problems I see with the systems in these boats is that they're either proprietary (think old Medallion systems) or the technology has been "lifted" from another system (like the Murphy screens) then modified by a third party which can make the quality of the solution implementation, firmware and support sketchy. The truly sketchy part comes when the firmware provided by the manufacture is modified by the third party. At this point the OEM has no responsibility for fixing anything but their original code and the third party either has to debug their code or prove the OEM's code is bad. Yeah, been here before too.

One only need look at the mess Medallion made over the years to boating systems to understand why many are gun shy jumping on the latest boating technology innovations. MasterCraft and Nautique have both had their fair share of failed gauge packages that required a rip and replace fix. Doesn't sound like much has changed. Should it all work flawlessly when that new boat is dropped off to you? Absolutely. Does it? Rarely. I think a lot of people jump in their cars and really don't realize the amount of testing, development and mountains of cash that has gone into making those what they are today. Sadly I don't see any boating manufacture being able to duplicate those levels of resources or investment to get to the quality of those systems any time soon.