Motor Oil

[AirTool]

Very impressive as always Tool. I would like to see if someone can just make this simple . . . The first person to post a link to or picture of the correct oil to use in a pcm 343 gets a cookie!!!

Page 28 - http://www.pcmengines.com/assets/Uploads/owners-2.pdf

OIL REQUIREMENTS - 10
ENGINE OIL RECOMMENDATIONS
Use of Supplemental Additives
Engine Oil Requirements
The following chart shows the recommended oil viscosity
for various ambient temperature ranges:
Prevailing Ambient Recommended A.P.I.
Temperature Classifi cation & Viscosity
Above 50°F SAE 15W-40 “GF-4/SM”
Below 50°F SAE 5W-30 “GF-4/SM”

I still prefer this oil: http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lub...300_Super.aspx

[Clibka]

[OKWAKEBDR]

Fast...maybe more later.

Cx and Sx are API ratings (American Petroleum Institute) C stands for "compression ignition" (read "Diesel") and S stands for "spark ignition" typically gasoline engines.

The G code is a different organization/society (can't remember the name off hand - and probably European)

Generally, the latest oil is okay (SJ, SM, SN) however:

Engines with flat tappet lifters need an old fashioned oil (obsolete specs) with ZDDP (the zddp was reduced/eliminated in more recent specs to prevent damage to catalytic convertors)

Engines with catalytic convertors need the latest spec suitable for catalyitic converters. I don't remember the spec for that...maybe SJ.

More info available if you have specific questions.

So the first 2 letters don't matter (just the organization that is rating the oil)? As long as the last two letters are SM?

[xrichard]

For heavily loaded boats (e.g. extra ballast) PCM changed its recommendation to Castrol HD40.

If you want to learn a lot about oil, look at bobistheoilguy.com and read the oil university articles. There is a lot written indicating the heavier weights are not such a great thing even for marine motors particularly because of startup wear. For $25 you can have your oil analyzed by Blackstone. A friend with an MB and PCM 343 did that had came back with so little wear on his oil at 50 hours that Blackstone recommended he extend his change intervals by 20 hours and reanalyze.

I'm going to send my oil in for analysis at the next change...probably a few more weeks. If folks are interested, I can post the results (PCM 343).

[laurie8888]

don't get intimidated, as air tool said just look for the API Doughnut (round symbol on can)

C14/SN.......Means good for diesel (C14) And good for petrol (SN)...SN is the latest release but you can also use SL, SM, > I use SL cos that's all that's available in the desert. The guys at the garage have no idea and will tell you its for diesel engines only cos that's what it says on the tin!

[Nordicron]

I know that 15-40 rotella stuff is some think dang oil! I had a hard time last fall getting it to suck out even after warming up on the hose. Outside air temps at the time were only in the thirties here in WI so that was part of it. I'm really really thinking about going to mobile 10-30 or 5-30 synthetic with the next oil change.

[AirTool]

I know that 15-40 rotella stuff is some think dang oil! I had a hard time last fall getting it to suck out even after warming up on the hose. Outside air temps at the time were only in the thirties here in WI so that was part of it. I'm really really thinking about going to mobile 10-30 or 5-30 synthetic with the next oil change.

PCM recommends a lighter weight weight oil for low temps: Below 50°F SAE 5W-30 “GF-4/SM”

[ericchile]

I would love to run mobil1 5w-30 in my 409. Mostly because that is what I put in all my other vehicles and it would mean less complication.

[scott resick]

Not to complicate this anymore, and I'd like to hear airtools reply to this. Weight is one thing but brands may be another. My father and brother in law both at one time worked at a bottling factory filling quarts of oil. They say they would fill many different companies bottles with the exact same product.

[AirTool]

They say they would fill many different companies bottles with the exact same product.

This is correct and probably becoming more popular every day. Here are some comments.

1. It is difficult for companies to actually develop their technology anymore. The rules for the oil product are being governed by the classifications we discussed (e.g. API SM). But lets not blame API. Some of the influence is from the government (EPA) pushing back on ingredients and some evolution due to the other technology like the catalytic convertor (also imposed by EPA) that can't withstand passing through some of the ingredients.

2. Another obvious for today is that the companies have actually combined. Exxon bought Mobil. Chevron bought Texaco, Gulf, Unocal. Other brands are gone like Fina, ARCO, Pennzoil, and so on. So I typically buy my Mobil ATF fluid at a Tiger Mart. But most Tiger Marts have the old Exxon red bottle products. Probably the same juice is in the red bottle versus the blue bottle.

3. Some oil companies never marketed products. They just specified them and /or made a label.

4. Some oil companies had crude that was better for lubricants than others like "Pennsylvania Crude"....it was better from the well to make a simple lubrication product. Those days are gone from both ends of the spectrum (Penn crude and simple products).

5. Some oil brands had no oil company behind them....like Valvoline and Quaker State. (Aren't Quakers from Penn state?) They were backed by a chemical products company maybe ADM IIRC.

6. Walmart oils have tested quite well. That's probably because the paid somebody to write a nice specification for them and then bid out some huge annual supply contract and got great (low) bids back for supply and bottling. Its all business at that point and no TV commercials are required to sell their oil.

7. I knew a guy that worked at Southwest Research Institute in San Antonio. SWRi is one of the highest ranking 3rd party testing and development companies. Back in the 80's when everyone was separate/competing/etc. SWRi would do the testing to validate all the products. He told me that typically Mobil products always came out on top. From oils to fuels and other products. All the products met the certifications but Mobil's exceeded the minimums by the biggest margin. But Mobil itself is gone now. The products are still there but who knows if they are unique or not.

8. I grew up on Havoline Supreme. I asked my dad (long ago) why he liked it so much and the answer was "Pennzoil and Quaker State come out of the bottle dark brown. Havoline comes out of the bottle clear and golden like honey." It made great sense to me at the time.

9. One more trivia. I need to look up the API history to check my memory. But I sold auto parts part time from 84 to 88. I remember the "red top" cardboard quarts of Pennzoil to be labeled SF/CD. That would be the F spec for gasoline engines and the D spec for Diesel engines. I think the gas spec is now on N. 84 was a long time ago.

10. In my garage is:

1. Mobil 1300 for my 206
2. I've forgotten what I have for my 99 Tahoe. But I think the Mobil 1300. I do change the viscosity in summer vs. winter to help keep my oil pressure up in the summer and not so high in the winter on startup.
3. Ford syn blend 5w20 for my 2010 f150 and 2011 expedition
4. I had old mobil 1300 from an oil jobber warehouse that had the zddp for my 93 chevy 4.3z pickup. It has flat tappet lifters. But I'm out of the old 1300 and need to use one of the oils the GT40 guys are using to have the zddp.
5. Leftover 5w30 Walmart oil I used when my wife's old 99 Navigator became a great consumer of oil.

11. Filters are:

1. Wix for the 206. High quality and black in color. Readily available at O'Reilly's.
2. Delco for the two Chevy's (Cheap at walmart)
3. Motorcraft for the two Fords. (Cheap at walmart)

12. Fuels are similar. Everyone refines to the industry (government) specs and distributes through the same terminals. Why would one company ship gasoline across the state when a competitor or independent refiner has gas right in the area. The only difference might be the additives that are put directly in the truck at the time of departure. Even those might not be different.

Note I've pointed out in another thread people get too hung up on brands and that it is more important to just change the oil. TRJBenj did kindly remind me/us that the flat tappet guys need to be more careful than that and have the best oil for their tappets and that is (unfortunately) a function of brand.

[AirTool]

Too late to edit but here is one more item.

Final added note: most of the development in modern time (1990 to 2010?) had been on the friction modifiers to optimize the performance and life of the multi viscosity oils. The friction modifiers are the ingredients that are put in to make the 15 weight base oil have the viscosity of a 40 weight base oil when hot. So cold (read "w" as in winter), the viscosity is that of a 15 base oil. But it doesn't thin so much when hot and retains the hot viscosity of a 40 weight oil. The viscosity curve would essentially cross that of a 40 weight base oil. These are the ingredients that usually degrade the fastest and coke in the cylinders. Early days they were plastic polymer coils that straightened when heated thus thickening the oil. I hope that is not the case anymore because of this note in the PCM manual:

IMPORTANT: The use of oils which contain “solid” additives, non-detergent oils or low quality oils specifically are not recommended.

The next wave of oil improvements will be reducing contaminates and having engineered blends from synthetic oil. But lets not forget. Synthetic oil is still oil....from the well...perhaps even a well in Pennsylvania.

[msbowhunter]

15 40 rotella for me

[cstiles]

Just my two cents, but I've always been happy that I have a heavier weight oil in the boat when I'm plowing around with thousands of pounds of ballast at 3400+ RPMS or running wide open to the dock at 5000 RPMS. We aren't doing that in our trucks...