2013 SAN 230 343 burning oil

[AirTool]

1. Possibly the rings didn't seat properly when the engine was(n't) broken in properly.

2. If the rings did seat properly, engines still need to burn oil. Generally, the top ring is the compression ring, then there is an oil ring and a wiper ring. If some oil doesn't make it past the oil rings, then then compression ring(s) runs dry which is a bad thing.

3. You also need to make sure your crankcase is properly ventilated. (I'm ashamed) I've not studied how that is done on the 330. Generally, poor crankcase ventilation will force abnormal amounts of oil vapor up into your intake.

So, the question would be "how much is too much"...answer: I don't know.

[shag]

I have owned boats with a 330, and the 343 in them and put several hundred hours on them with good maintenance. They did not 'use' any noticeable oil. There is something wrong with your engine IMO, based on what you are saying - and I would also have a long discussion with my dealer... Something doesn't add up.

[nyryan2001]

Zip- PCM will never tell you these engines burn oil as early as 30-35hrs. That data is a result of a test Indmar did on their 5.7L 350 Monsoons. Pretty much the same engine in your boat. The reason why Shawn and I are offering that as a possibility is recently a few Malibu owners are reporting 1-2qts low at 50hrs, and trying to make sense of it.

Now, if you can prove you are burning 2-4qts in 50hrs, PCM may step in and make things right. PCM by far is the most customer friendly as compared to Indmar. You need to be super tight with your dealer and document everything immediately.

[swc5150]

We've owned 3 330's and 2 343's (still running 343), and have never burned any noticeable oil. We also never burned any oil in the 9 Indmars we've owned/own. The group is spot on, your engine needs to be gone through.

[Quinner]

Really curious what "running heavy" is in real numbers??
Boat is like 4400lbs dry, add fuel of 200-300lbs so your 4.6k before ballast/people/wake tabs.
if factory ballast only add 1k which already has you close to 6k.

Like Scott mentioned above have never seen any oil use in an Excal however that would be pushing 3k of boat and an average of 500lbs in people weight.

In comparison to a straight inboard would running twice as heavy cut the change interval in half, thus every 25hrs? If so then 85hrs without an oil change in a "heavy" boat would be like me pushing 170hrs without changing, in that case being low at that point would be no surprise.

When you deploy those surf tabs does it cut speed? Would have to imagine it does, again adding more load.

[nyryan2001]

we need to post up the Indmar study on here for everybody to see.

Little help Shawn?

[swc5150]

Really curious what "running heavy" is in real numbers??
Boat is like 4400lbs dry, add fuel of 200-300lbs so your 4.6k before ballast/people/wake tabs.
if factory ballast only add 1k which already has you close to 6k.

Like Scott mentioned above have never seen any oil use in an Excal however that would be pushing 3k of boat and an average of 500lbs in people weight.

In comparison to a straight inboard would running twice as heavy cut the change interval in half, thus every 25hrs? If so then 85hrs without an oil change in a "heavy" boat would be like me pushing 170hrs without changing, in that case being low at that point would be no surprise.

When you deploy those surf tabs does it cut speed? Would have to imagine it does, again adding more load.

That's an interesting thought? My experiences are limited to basically a 1/4 tank of fuel, a 98lb wife, and occasionally a spotter (when on public water). A handful of guys over on BOS have had issues using some oil in the 343 in a 200, albeit nothing like this OP is seeing. The thought was the high revs at 36mph with the OSC hull.

I'm curious to hear what the wake guys are seeing for oil usage, and their change intervals.

[Westlotorn]

I agree with several posts above, this engine should use zero oil. In defense of the Original poster modern engines do not use oil and many have been spoiled into not checking the engine oil. This can be a fatal mistake. Running with no oil can void any warranty ever written. I bet one of these new engines retail for $6,000 plus installation. The lesson learned as already mentioned, check oil before use every time. Engines lose oil when there is a problem, not when things are normal. By checking every time you find problems before they become expensive repairs. If the boat has sat overnight all you have to do is pull the dipstick and look, no need to wipe and recheck because the oil settled to the bottom overnight. This check takes all of 15 seconds, time well spent.
These engines run roller lifters on the camshafts. Thick oils do not lubricate these well. I would stay with factory recommended oils to avoid damage to the roller lifters. 5-30 o 5-40 I suspect. Some may be 5-20.

[Ziplock]

Little more information gathered for you. I spent some time on the phone with my dealer. I explained everything again and he brought up a very good point. Some very vital time frames were missing from my initial post that may clear things up.


Back to July.


Lost oil pressure coming off of plane after a faller rider.
Checked oil to find no reading on the dipstick.
Immediately sent a friend the marina to get oil.
Within about 15 mins he had returned and I filled the engine until I got a reading.


I think it is now pretty clear I over filled the engine.


Last Saturday.
Everything had happened just as it had happened back in July. With no friends to fetch more oil I was forced the limp the boat back to the dock.
I did mention the boat burned another 4 quarts. Well I really wouldn't know. I assumed that since everything happened just as it had happened back in July that it would indeed take another 4 quarts.


I am glad that I did not have any oil on hand or I would done exactly what I did before. Not doing so I think we will be able see just how much the engine has been burned. After talking with my dealer I went back up the shop where the boat is stored excited to check the oil after the engine had cooled. Unfortunately I still did not get a reading.


The boat is going to the dealership first thing in the morning. I am anxious to see the amount of oil still in the engine.

I would also like to apologize. This whole scare of "My engine is burning 4 quarts of oil in 50hrs!?" was because of my lack of knowlegde. I will report back with more details tomorrow afternoon.

[shawndoggy]

we need to post up the Indmar study on here for everybody to see.

Little help Shawn?

http://www.supraboats.com/bbs/showth...hange-your-oil!

Sent from my BNTV600 using Tapatalk

[DanielC]

ALL engines use oil.
But not my engine, you say, YOU ARE WRONG!

Ok, I am through yelling. Here is what happens, if you think your engine is not "using oil". The oil that is being used is being replaced with combustion byproducts.

The study by Indmar may be wrong on some data points, but every engine is different. But it does point out what we all know, it takes more throttle to move a heavily loaded boat.
A heavily loaded boat engine will use more oil. How the engine was broke in will also influence oil consumption.
Manufacturing tolerance deviations, even within specifications, will influence oil consumption.

The first few hours on an engine are critical. The piston rings need to be "seated". The piston do not "just sit there" under the power stroke, cylinder pressure gets behind the rings and forces them hard against the cylinder walls. This causes microscopic wear on the cylinder walls, and rings, and helps the rings "match" the cylinder walls.
How do you seat the rings? Wide open throttle, to max RPM, and then close the throttle, and let the engine slow down against the inertia of the boat. The engine must be lightly loaded during this time.
This is what happens on a new engine. The WOT forces the rings hard against the cylinder walls, and this does wear the rings, and walls slightly. These metal particles are then washed away, into the oil by the high vacuum from slowing down. When you slow down, the high vacuum sucks more oil into the cylinder. This extra oil helps wash the wear particles away. This is critical. if the boat is heavily loaded, it slows down too fast for the washing away process to help much.
However, you must not get the engine hot. While the engine is breaking in, it will have a tendency to run hot, because tolerances are tight, and this creates more friction.

The 25 hour oil change is critical. Knowing the high rate normal of wear on an engine. The oil is contaminated with metal particles, and combustion byproducts, In my opinion, the oil should be changed at 5 hours, and then again at 25.

[nyryan2001]

I agree with all of this ^^^. However, the problem is all the engine manf's prescribed break in procedures don't support the drive it like you stole it for the first 5hrs approach. They prescribe the granny approach, nothing over 3k rpm first 2-4hrs etc. fairly certain if you were to have a major engine issue doing that during break in they could pull data from the ECM showing you broke procedures RPM wise and be liable.

isnt the purpose of the on water 1hr QAQC check at the factory to nail it hard and seat the rings?

[DanielC]

I am not saying "drive it like you stole it"
I think you have to push the engine to red line, even when new. This is why. The piston travels farther up in the cylinder bore, at maximum RPM, especially on the end of the exhaust stroke, and beginning of the intake stroke. If you never hit a high RPM, until several hours were on the engine, you have established a wear pattern that is now being changed by the different engine operation conditions.
With a brand new engine, go to redline, or if you live at altitude, go as fast as the engine will get to, without holding WOT for more than about 10 to 20 seconds. In other words, if holding WOT for another minute gets 25 more RPM, eventually, do not do that.

An engine is not broke in after an hour, not even at 25 hours. The engine will still benefit from trying to do "break in operation" for about 50 to 100 hours.

Once the engine is fully warm, and you can safely do it, go to WOT, and just as the engine "touches" max RPM, fully close the throttle, down to an idle. Accelerate to a clean planing speed, a speed where the engine is not working hard. Vary the speed while cruising around for minute or two. For a Ski boat, 22 to maybe 35 MPH. After doing that, back to an idle, and then WOT again. Probably the same for a wake board boat, but DO NOT FILL THE BALLAST TANKS AT THIS TIME. Do not load 12 of your closest friends in the boat. Do not load a bunch of anchors, or other heavy stuff in the boat. It might be a good idea to have less than a half of a tank of gas. Try to keep idling to a minimum too.
If you have a wake boat, I would suggest not filling the ballast tanks for at least the 25 hours. No surfing either. Avoid operation that puts a heavy load on the boat. This probably means no tubing either.

If you have a ski boat, on a slalom lake, you can possibly get away with only putting about 10 hours on the boat, before you start pulling skiers. Think about it. About 20 to 25 seconds of a pull, and then a stop. Idle for a few seconds, then pull again.

You must check the oil often during the break in process. New engines can use lots of oil. This is normal. An early oil change, or two or three on a new engine will be beneficial too.

This may seem like a lot of work with a new boat, and it is. but when you have to spend 60 to 70 K on a SKI boat, it is worth it.

I did the above procedure on my new 1997 Ski Nautique. It has 2509.6 hours on it, and the engine is still running good, just waiting for me to start using it again. And the days are getting longer now, summer is coming.

[JDK]

The 25 hour oil change is critical. Knowing the high rate normal of wear on an engine. The oil is contaminated with metal particles, and combustion byproducts, In my opinion, the oil should be changed at 5 hours, and then again at 25.

I disagree.
The 25 hr. (or manufacturer recommended) first oil change is critical - but an early change as you suggest at 5 hrs. is a bad idea. The break in period is a time of controlled and expected wear on a new engine. Replacing the oil so early throws the 'expected' part of the break in out the window. Manufacturers allow for this in their 'recommended' time.
Also - more important than 'how' an engine is run during its first few trips in a boat (or car or whatever) is that it is heat cycled properly (start, idle, run, idle, shut down and completely cooled down).

[Westlotorn]

Modern Piston Rings break in right away, Modern goes back to the early 90's. Nearly zero break in time for piston rings any more.
The entire engine is new parts and they all need to break in properly. Revving a brand new engine to red line can cause problems.
As one poster mentioned above the total heat cycle is very important, do not get a new engine hot, heat does a lot of damage and new engines create more heat than a seated in engine so be careful with the brand new engine. 25 hours should get you well into break in.
I would be comfortable starting to load the boat for normal use, ski or wake boarding after 5 hours break in.
These engines are designed to run with the open cooling system so they are much looser internally than the automotive engine.
The Piston to Cyl Wall clearance is loose so the piston can survive in the marine environment. This will allow a little oil consumption.
It should be very little, well less than quart in 25 hours use while current automotive engines are expected by the EPA to provide 20,000 miles per quart of oil consumed.