Alternate aftermarket gateway for dead faria gateway & gauges

[lbz99smp]

Hi,

Just seeing if anyone has considered one of the alternate ECM gateways on the market. From a quick look at these , it appears they plug into most ECM modules and convert the data to a NMEA data signal. From this conversion any MFD can be used to display engine information. Faria also do a range of digital gauges that are similar to the SAN gauges with a digital LCD screen read out and analogue style display that may be used.

A few links below for reference. It seems this could be a alternative at a reasonable cost that would closely replicate the original format of the early 2000's boats.

Fox Marine Gateway.
https://fox-marine.com/index.php?rou...tegory&path=81

Faria MG3000
https://fariabeede.com/2-pages/prod_...Gauge=2_mg3000

You tube install
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OldAiFfNYg4

Interested to see if anyone has tried this approach to resolve the dead gateway / gauges issue.

[shag]

I would be very interested in this if we could get a confirmation that it works. Sounds like it just plugs into the diagrams cable. Do those Faria gauges in that link receive the Blue tooth signal? Or do you need to run a wire to them...

[bturner]

This is some cool stuff in the video.

Would be really interesting to see if you could tie this into the existing network on the newer boats and if so what the panel would look like. Could be a viable option to fix the interface on older Link Systems when they age out and start dying.

[WakeHawk]

I'm going to be embarking on a project to rid myself of the Faria gateway box and gauges in a 2008 SANTE 210 this winter. Will be installing a Garmin GPSMap 743xsv multifunction display. Veratron has some new products out to make adapting to NMEA 2000 less painful, they have a product called the LinkUp that will translate J1939 signals to NMEA 2000 at a better price point. They also have adapters for resistive sensors as well like the fuel level which is what gauge died in my boat and sent me on this quest since Faria isn't making replacement parts any more.

J1939 LinkUp: https://us-shop.veratron.com/index.c...ay---j1939.htm

Resistive sensor LinkUp: https://us-shop.veratron.com/index.c...-resistive.htm

I will probably post a thread as I get into this project.

[bturner]

Like the VDO engine box concept and the Veratron gear. Now if there were some way of adding the Nautique Link information and control into the mix. Looks like you could add the tank levels, control the stereo and get all the gauge information but I don't see a way to turn on/off stuff like lights or pumps in these systems. Looks like a lot of work and research still to get one of these to work but the technology is definitely getting better/easier.

Looking forward to your journey with your conversion.....

[SilentSeven]

.....it appears they plug into most ECM modules and convert the data to a NMEA data signal. From this conversion any MFD can be used to display engine information....

Does anyone know what year PCM engines became compliant with these standards? I'm wondering if this standard is tied to the first year of Zero Off capabilities....2007.

[WakeHawk]

Like the VDO engine box concept and the Veratron gear. Now if there were some way of adding the Nautique Link information and control into the mix. Looks like you could add the tank levels, control the stereo and get all the gauge information but I don't see a way to turn on/off stuff like lights or pumps in these systems. Looks like a lot of work and research still to get one of these to work but the technology is definitely getting better/easier.

Looking forward to your journey with your conversion.....

I've been doing some research into what all added functionality can be added with a MFD. Once a NMEA 2000 network is in the boat digital switching can be added for controlling lighting, ballast pumps, etc. this gets a bit more involved but is possible. there are several options out there for digital switching form Czone, Empribus, and Maretron, all look like pretty solid gear, and each have their pros and cons. my primary objective for this off season is to rid myself of the Faria gateway box and gauges, I will also be getting rid of the factory Clarion stereo equipment, the amps are already gone upgraded to JL Audio, the head unit is next to go, I'm just waiting for a Fusion MS-RA770 to come in stock, I will network this in to the NMEA 2000 and be able to run it from the Garmin in the helm with zone control and all that nice modern stuff. this upgrade should rid my boat of the few minor things that annoy me.

[WakeHawk]

Does anyone know what year PCM engines became compliant with these standards? I'm wondering if this standard is tied to the first year of Zero Off capabilities....2007.

I'm pretty sure all the zero off boats use a j1939 CAN bus that can then be translated to NMEA 2000 by adapters from several companies. even if your boat doesn't have a J1939 CAN bus it is pretty straight forward to convert analog gauge signals to NMEA 2000, once you have the signals converted to NMEA 2000 it really opens up what you are able to do as far as refitting.

[bturner]

I've been doing some research into what all added functionality can be added with a MFD. Once a NMEA 2000 network is in the boat digital switching can be added for controlling lighting, ballast pumps, etc. this gets a bit more involved but is possible. there are several options out there for digital switching form Czone, Empribus, and Maretron, all look like pretty solid gear, and each have their pros and cons. my primary objective for this off season is to rid myself of the Faria gateway box and gauges, I will also be getting rid of the factory Clarion stereo equipment, the amps are already gone upgraded to JL Audio, the head unit is next to go, I'm just waiting for a Fusion MS-RA770 to come in stock, I will network this in to the NMEA 2000 and be able to run it from the Garmin in the helm with zone control and all that nice modern stuff. this upgrade should rid my boat of the few minor things that annoy me.

Hope you open a thread on this and document the journey. Looks like a great winter project.

[SilentSeven]

I'm pretty sure all the zero off boats use a j1939 CAN bus that can then be translated to NMEA 2000 by adapters from several companies. even if your boat doesn't have a J1939 CAN bus it is pretty straight forward to convert analog gauge signals to NMEA 2000, once you have the signals converted to NMEA 2000 it really opens up what you are able to do as far as refitting.

Forgive my ignorance - is there a dongle / black box / dohicky that accepts engine analog signals and converts them to NMEA2000 format? This sounds suspiciously like what the faria box does....(not sure if the Faria box output is NMEA format or something proprietary...).

If there is indeed such a conversion box then I think the faria gauge fix for non-canbus boats (ie / pre 2007) might become something like this - a) install an analog to NMEA200O converter and b) replace the factory gauges with a conforming gauge kit. Is this correct?

I'll confess that I think current Faria gauge replacement kit offered by Nautique lacks any design appeal....anything that would let me select some different options would be a net positive.


EDIT: Is this non-canbus to nmea converter box? https://fox-marine.com/index.php?rou...&product_id=73 Description says this uses ODB2 inputs...would this work on a pre-2007?

[WakeHawk]

Forgive my ignorance - is there a dongle / black box / dohicky that accepts engine analog signals and converts them to NMEA2000 format? This sounds suspiciously like what the faria box does....(not sure if the Faria box output is NMEA format or something proprietary...).

If there is indeed such a conversion box then I think the faria gauge fix for non-canbus boats (ie / pre 2007) might become something like this - a) install an analog to NMEA200O converter and b) replace the factory gauges with a conforming gauge kit. Is this correct?

I'll confess that I think current Faria gauge replacement kit offered by Nautique lacks any design appeal....anything that would let me select some different options would be a net positive.


EDIT: Is this non-canbus to nmea converter box? https://fox-marine.com/index.php?rou...&product_id=73 Description says this uses ODB2 inputs...would this work on a pre-2007?

yes, the basic concept is to take what the existing signals in the boat are, and to use adapters to translate those signals to what the new gear can interpret. the issue with the Faria gateway boxes and associated gauges is many of the replacement gages are not available any more. The Faria gateway box operates similarly to the retrofits that are being discussed, but the output from the box goes out to their gauges using their proprietary serial bus. the advantage of getting rid of the Faria gateway box is parts are actually available for NMEA 2000 systems and it is a standard CAN bus protocol so the system will be more flexible in how you want to deploy it.

I'm not too familiar with pre-2007 boats, but I would think that product would work, the only drawback I can think of would be having to route cable from the OBD2 connector all the way to the helm. With a different adapter you might be able to use the existing wiring that is already pulled to the helm and wire up an adapter like the following one from Actisense:

https://actisense.com/products/emu-1...0-engine-data/

This might save you some work. You would need to study the wiring diagrams, the ones for my boats are available on this website, it looks like most of the wiring diagrams for earlier boats are available as well. there are also some MFDs that you might be able to wire up without any adapters like this one from Veratron:

https://us-shop.veratron.com/index.c...6089A2.cfusion

Another option that is coming out is this guage from Veratron:

https://www.veratron.com/news/vmh-35/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Qeh1H-SnFQ

that thing looks great and judging from the limited information currently available will probably be able to be directly wired up without any adapters. I plan on installing one of these when they are available to complement the Garmin that I'm installing.

I know on my 2008 the Zero Off is completely separate from the Faria box, I'm not too familiar with the older boats, so you would need to check and see if the cruise control is integrated with the Faria box or not. That may add complexity to a refit project.

[SilentSeven]

OK. Thanks...helpful. Seems like the 24k question for the older boats is to ID the ECU and match it to an available NMEA converter Once you have that mapping, you should be in business. My hunch is that the there may not be a solution for the older PCM GT-40 based engines but there might a solution for the PCM Excalibur engines up to 2007. Of course, the GT-40 boats have non-bus type guage kit so they really don't have the Faria exposure.

Also, I think actually the zero-off become available in 2008, not 2007 and was tied to the ECU change. IIR the zero-off system directly integrates with the ECU for throttle control while the Perfect Pass uses a mechanical mechanism. You're correct that some Faria boxes have integrated Perfect Pass units. I think the solution for those boats would be to go an external PP control box. (Mine has an external box).

For us early Excalibur engine guys, need to do some digging to ID the ECU and get the story on availability of NMEA converter. If indeed it exists, this opens up the playing field for alternate gauge solutions when the Faria box quits.

[MN Ryan]

My '07 211 has Perfect Pass, so I believe it was '08 (or perhaps mid-'07).

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[WakeHawk]

2008 was the transition from Perfect Pass to Zero Off, if I remember right both options were available that model year, the 210 I bought has Zero Off. Fortunately, the Zero Off cruise system is completely separate from the Faria gateway box, it uses a couple of y-connectors to plug into the J1939 signal and to get power. The Zero Off will work just fine with a completely dead Faria gateway box, I had to do this several years ago when my gateway box went out right before the warranty was up and I rode like that for a few weeks while waiting for the dealer to get parts in.

[MN Ryan]

Yeah, I unfortunately need to upgrade my PP because the display is going out, which means I need to do a nearly $1k upgrade to Stargazer. Really hoping the Gateway doesn't go out shortly thereafter!!!

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