Ongoing starting/running problem on a 1983 (2001) model

[richard5150]

I have a 1983 ski nautique (2001) with a Ford 351 commander engine. Last couple of years, usually after I have been on the lake for a while it has trouble starting. It may take several tries to start and then it runs fine until you put it in gear or under a load and then it dies. Then it takes several tries to start it and once you put it in gear it will bogg down or die. When it acts up it can last several hours and eventually gets me home but it is very frustrating. It does not neccessarily happen every time I take it out.

I have been recently told that it may be vapor lock and that I should try a wooden clothes-pin on the fuel line. Also told to run it with the blower on all the time or prop open the engine compartment to cool it off.

Does this sound right? If so, is there a more permanent solution?

Thanks, Richard

[other1]

RE: Ongoing starting/running problem on a 1983 (2001) model

My 83 2001 only has an issue when I shut her down. Then when I try to start her up (50% of the time?) the starter doesn't make the slightest noise. The strange thing is there is never a set amount of time before it finally decides to turn over. I can't figure out if it is a wiring issue or if it has something to do with letting the engine cool down. If I just leave her running for the duration she will run like a champ all day.

Is your 2001 running for a few hours and then having a problem, or is it as soon as you start the boat and try to put her in gear? Is it backfiring through your carburetor at all? Do you have electronic ignition? Lot of places to start looking for solutions!

[surroundsound64]

RE: Ongoing starting/running problem on a 1983 (2001) model

I've had similar problems. I went to autozone and bought some rubber fuel injection hose, slit it open one one side and put it around the fuel line that is going from my fuel pump to my carburetor. It did seem to help, but when I shut the engine off I try to still crack the engine cover to. Occasionally I still have problems and when I do I usually take some wd-40, starting fluid, carb cleaner... or whatever else is in the boat and give it a shot and it'll usually fire up.

Other1, I also have the same problem as you described. When I turn the key nothing happens. I have found that if I wiggle the prop engage switch around and jiggle the throttle it seems to work. I just need to take it all apart and clean the contacts and stuff but I haven't gotten around to doing it yet.

Hope that helps.

[882001]

RE: Ongoing starting/running problem on a 1983 (2001) model

do you still have points? if you do thats most likely your problem. try www.vintageperformance.com

[richard5150]

RE: Ongoing starting/running problem on a 1983 (2001) model

Yes, I still have points. I would definitely like to convert to electronic ignition at some point. Would this help if it is already running and I put it in gear and it boggs or dies. Several people have described a similar problem as mine and they have replaced carbs, ignition and still have a problem.

[Andrew]

RE: Ongoing starting/running problem on a 1983 (2001) model

richard, sounds like have distributor problems. u can upgrade to electronic ignition ( i prefer the standard system because i know how to fix it if something goes wrong, but thats just me) a quick cleaning may solve ur problems, but i'd go ahead and plan on replacing the rotor points and the condenser...

[wristy_j]

I've got about the same problem, and have had it on and off for years (in an '82 Ski Nautique w/ Ford 351). I had the carb rebuilt a couple years ago, and it ran, but wouldn't go over about 25 mph. My uncle helped me figure out that the idiots that did the carb rebuild put a hole through the rubber vaccuum seal for the secondary barrels. We fixed that, and it ran great... For a little while. The same exact problem Richard described came back. Although for me, it gets bad enough that I need to be towed in after it stalls a few times (I can get it restarted with WOT the first few times). We cleaned the points, and that got it started again, but the same thing happened after taking it out for a little while. So at the end of last season I brought it to another mechanic, who said I had water in the fuel system. He cleaned out the fuel system, installed a new fuel separator/filter, installed a new coil and distributor, and said he got it running great (although not on the water). He said he didn't touch the carb, so it might need some adjustments at full speed. Anyway, I picked it up this spring, and the first two times out it was very tough to start, but once started, it ran as good as it ever has. Idled perfectly, accelerated with no hesitation, etc. All was great. Until the 3rd time out. The same problem came back. Started idling rough, then it would die. Got it restarted a few times, and then needed to be towed back in. I heard from someone else that they fixed a simliar problem by putting an inline fuel filter before the carb, and that the problem was from his gas tank getting dusty debris in the fuel from oxidizing (or something) gumming up the carb, and the fuel filter fixed it for him. I'm not sure, but I thought I saw some water drops in the carb when I looked last time this happened. I have no idea what's going on anymore and don't know what to do. It might be water getting back into the fuel system somehow, or it might be debris from the tank messing up the carb again. I don't know if that helps you at all, but if I get mine figured out, I'll definitely post the solution.

J

[bchesley]

I have a commander and had a similiar issue. What I did is I first got all of my ignition in perfect order. Electronic conversion, new wires, new plugs, new cap and rotor, and finally set my timing at 6 degrees before TDC. That helped a ton, but not perfect. Installed a new carb and still had the same issue. What I finally realized is that when I shut the engine down I was getting fuel dripping out of the bowl into the intake flooding it out. CHecked fuel pressure and it was good so next was the carb floats. What I found out is most rebuild kits and or new carbs have the float set for an newer engine that has a level motor. The old 1 to 1 engines are on a pretty good slant and with the floats set too high they will dump fuel after you shut your engine off. Lowered the floats and ding ding we have a perfect running boat.......

Brad

[jeffk]

You can get a 4X4 off rod carb kit that will fix the angle running issues.

[wristy_j]

Does the dumping of fuel and flooding happen even if you don't shut it down? Like if you just let it idle for a while? I'm getting this problem without ever shutting the engine down. Good tips though, yet another thing to check

[bchesley]

Yes it can load up if its dumping too much fuel. Mine would load up after a while. It had a small drip at idle. Not bad but enough to get the plugs soaked with gas if you idled too long. It should not have a drip anytime it runs. All the fuel should me atomizing.

Brad

[richard5150]

Ok, I replaced carb (holley 4160), new fuel pump, new petronix electronic ignition, new coil, new fuel lines from tank to carb, fuel filter, emptied gas tank, cleaned fuel pick-up and screen, checked cooling system, new thermostat, starter is good, plugs good, carb does not appear to be flooding, never back-fired, never seen black smoke, runs at 160 degrees but can climb to 200 after you shut it off.

The boat still has a problem mostly running rough and dying under a load when hot. It is 92 to 100 degrees outside. Floats were adjusted in carb for angle of the engine. When it is acting up bad you can start it 20 times in a row and it will die when you try to take off. This is only after you have been out for a while and the boat is running fine. Don't tell me about vapor lock because we have had this boat for 24 years in the same climate and never had vapor lock the first 15-20 years.

Tracy posted this same problem June 4,2006 (stalls when hot) she has the same engine as mine. I don't know how to reach her to see how she may have fixed it.

Any other ideas would be appreciated. Thanks, Richard

[bchesley]

What is your timing set at? Have you checked for vacuum leaks?

[richard5150]

timing was recently set at recommended once before and after the new carb/ignition. Not sure what or how to check for vacuum leaks. Runs great when it is working.

[richard]

hard start again

I vote bchesley,the excess gas choking the engine.