My little NSS project - 99 SN

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • High altitude
    • Oct 2011
    • 206

    • Larkspur, CO

    • 2014 SN 200 OB

    My little NSS project - 99 SN

    Okay, last year I tried building a Surfgate-style system for my Ski Nautique. It was fun building and testing it, but in the end, it didn’t work. This year I am building an NSS style system and thought I would share my results. Things are pretty basic right now, but I believe in incremental testingand development due to the costs and time required.

    My testing setup is made from ½ plywood attached to 2x4’s. (see pics) The 2x4’s then attach to the swim platform. It’s the easiest thing to use and I can cut various shapes in about five minutes. I started off with just a demo day with no surfing involved. I wanted to test the proof of concept as well as downselect a few options for behind the boat testing. I tried various horizontal displacements as well as vertical displacements and came away thinking an approximate 2" horizontal and 1" vertical displacement were the optimal setup. I then began to vary the weight. It appears that weight is going to play a pretty big factor in this as well. The optimal setup would be to have even weighting and allow the “plate” (or wooden cutout in this case) to enhance the surf wave on either side. This did not happen. It’s a real bummer because that is one of the huge advantages of the NSS or SurfGate systems. The 1999 Ski Nautique hull appears to be one that just needs to be leaned over in order to get a good wave. I was able to get some nice waves but like most people I want a bit more. I went back to my jigsaw and cut another NSS “plate” which had even more surface area exposed to the water. While the actual displacement was the same, more surface area was exposed because it was longer (in the horizontal plane) as well as higher (in the vertical). It seemed like a good idea at the time, but that didn’t work as planned. Too much displacement actually created a worse wave. In the end, I went back to a fairly modest displacement option. This is the same problem that I had with the Surfgate design. It actually delayed the convergence TOO much.

    Setup: 2.25"horizontal displacement; 1" vertical displacement
    Weight: Driver 145, front sac 260, surf side ~400, rear 800+ (for the picture). When I surfed, there was 105 lbs in the drivers seat.

    Overall,I am pleased so far. I can remove the NSS system in less than it takes to fill/empty a 350lb sac. The delayed convergence seems to help shape the wave quite nicely. When I actually surfed it, the sweet spot was further back which was nice. Push was good but not great. There was a little crossover spray from the NSS side that I didn’t like but that could be eliminated. Next week I will test some different configuration plus the “regular” side. That should be a challenge as the prop rotation makes a HUGE difference with this boat. In the future I hope to make a slightly larger plate but use less displacement. (3/4 vertical, 1 ¾ horizontal) I will be interested to see the results.

    Please let me know what you think. BTW…I don’t care if you think I am ruining a perfectly good ski boat. I personally love skiing the course and do so every week (sometimes every day). I also like to drink beer and hang out with my family and friends….and surfing is perfect for that. -Marc
    Attached Files
    Last edited by High altitude; 06-02-2013, 10:17 AM.
  • scottb7
    1,000 Post Club Member
    • Aug 2011
    • 2198

    • Carson City, Nevada

    • 2014 G21 (Current) 2008 SANTE 210

    #2
    wake looks so good!

    Comment

    • NCH2oSki
      1,000 Post Club Member
      • Jul 2003
      • 1159

      • Maryville, TN

      • 2005 ski nautique 206 SE

      #3
      How about a picture of it installed, even though its in test mode, I'd still like to see it. Good luck and keep posting your results.
      2005 Ski Nautique 206 SE, Acme 422, PP SG 8.0, ND Tower
      2011 strada with strada bindings

      Prior Boats:
      1986 Sunbird skier with 150 Evinrude VRO
      1992 Mastercraft prostar 190, with Powerslot
      1999 Ski Nautique GT-40
      1999 Sport Nautique, GT-40 FCT,



      www.skiersofknoxville.org

      Comment

      • super01
        • Jun 2009
        • 277


        • 2008 Super Air 230 2001 Super Air 210 (Sold)

        #4
        That's really cool, and yes the wave looks great! Do you need to get into the water to remove it? I too would like to see more installed pictures.
        2008 Super Air 230 ZR6
        2001 Super Air 210 GT-40 (Sold)

        Comment

        • nyryan2001
          1,000 Post Club Member
          • Mar 2013
          • 1993

          • Lake Anna


          #5
          Marc- great job. Even with NSS I get beat results cheating to one side vs even weighting. I will tell you the heavier I go with weight... The less NSS extension you need. And the reciprocal, the lighter weight you have the better the wave when the NSS stick out further.
          2019 G23 450
          2014 G23 550
          2013 G23 450
          2011 Malibu Wakesetter 247
          2007 Yamaha AR210

          Comment

          • High altitude
            • Oct 2011
            • 206

            • Larkspur, CO

            • 2014 SN 200 OB

            #6
            I'll get pictures posted this evening. It's very easy to install and remove and I can do it sitting on the swim deck (or leaning over the back end).

            The wake is pretty clean right now but I want to make it a bit bigger. Very interesting about the inverse correlation between weight and extension. I never thought of that but it makes sense. I think I might try a few new designs based on this new info.

            Thanks for the inputs! -Marc

            Comment

            • High altitude
              • Oct 2011
              • 206

              • Larkspur, CO

              • 2014 SN 200 OB

              #7
              As requested...here are the pics showing how it attaches. Basically, it just slips in between the swim deck and the hull. The 2x4's then extend backwards and are bolted in using eye-hole lags. Like I said previously, you can remove or add it in about two minutes.

              Stillworking on various shapes. You can see from picture #1 that I had cut off some of the downward directed displacement. On pic#3 you can see one of the three lags I use. It's obviously not screwed in.

              http://

              http://

              http://

              Comment

              • hondaprlud
                Senior Member of PLANETNAUTIQUE
                • Jul 2008
                • 568

                • OH-IO


                #8
                Cool project. The wave looks great
                19 SANTE 210
                08 SANTE 210 ZR6
                08 SANTE 230 ZR6
                04 Super Air 210 Team Edition Ex343- Loved that boat
                96 Sport Nautique GT-40 - First Nautique
                88 Baja Ski Sport- First boat

                Comment

                • HS
                  1,000 Post Club Member
                  • Oct 2007
                  • 1333

                  • Sammamish, WA

                  • 2010 SANTE 210 (Sold)

                  #9
                  Impressive. Have never seen a wave like that behind a SN!
                  2010 Super Air Nautique 210 Team Edition

                  Comment

                  • nyryan2001
                    1,000 Post Club Member
                    • Mar 2013
                    • 1993

                    • Lake Anna


                    #10
                    Marc- love it brother, keep the pics coming.

                    I reccomend the following based on the 1 pic of the wave you posted:

                    speed up some, to around 11-11.4. good sized wave but looks like you are in the 10-10.5mph range.

                    Cheat the boat some leaning to the surfside.... roughly 60/40 to 70/30ish weighting in the rear. add a little more weigh to the rear also...maybe another 500 if you can.

                    I think if you do this and dial it in... you are going to throw some folks into a rage working to duplicate what you have done.
                    2019 G23 450
                    2014 G23 550
                    2013 G23 450
                    2011 Malibu Wakesetter 247
                    2007 Yamaha AR210

                    Comment

                    • super01
                      • Jun 2009
                      • 277


                      • 2008 Super Air 230 2001 Super Air 210 (Sold)

                      #11
                      Good job! Simple and easy solution, very functional, and compare that to the cost of an add on NSS kit??? Yeah, people are going to want to dupicate it for sure...
                      2008 Super Air 230 ZR6
                      2001 Super Air 210 GT-40 (Sold)

                      Comment

                      • High altitude
                        • Oct 2011
                        • 206

                        • Larkspur, CO

                        • 2014 SN 200 OB

                        #12
                        Originally posted by nyryan2001 View Post
                        Marc- love it brother, keep the pics coming.

                        I reccomend the following based on the 1 pic of the wave you posted:

                        speed up some, to around 11-11.4. good sized wave but looks like you are in the 10-10.5mph range.

                        Cheat the boat some leaning to the surfside.... roughly 60/40 to 70/30ish weighting in the rear. add a little more weigh to the rear also...maybe another 500 if you can.

                        I think if you do this and dial it in... you are going to throw some folks into a rage working to duplicate what you have done.
                        Thanks for the inputs! I will try a combination of things. No doubt the weight will help. The problem is it's a "little" ski boat with almost no storage to put bags. I actually built a whole sunpad area that covers all the sacs and I want to keep it that way. The good news story is I will actually have people on the boat at some point instead of just myself and one other dude working on this. That will help quite a bit. I will probably through a few extra bags in to simulate people next time.

                        As for the speed, it's actually at 8.5 MPH on the PP. I know that is crazy slow (we use 10.5 on my neighbor's 210) but it has always been the best speed for this boat. Every other speed would result in a worse wave. Since I am working with a new design I need to remember to continue to vary the speed. I wish there was a way to "measure" push without a rider because I could try so many more options. Alas...that is not going to happen. There is no substitute for time spent behind the boat.

                        This weekend I will landscape, waterski and test more designs. Hopefully by the end of the weekend I will be reporting back with some new and exciting results. Again, thanks for all your inputs...please keep it up. -Marc

                        Comment

                        • High altitude
                          • Oct 2011
                          • 206

                          • Larkspur, CO

                          • 2014 SN 200 OB

                          #13
                          OK...back with some results but no pictures. Hoenestly, I was having too much fun and just forgot to snap any.

                          Bottom line is the suggestions on this site combine with a few tweaks to my "NSS" system worked out incredibly well. I ended up removing about 1.25 inches of horizontal displacement and added some weight. It made for an incredible wave. Nice long pocket and plenty of push. I rode it both on my slow, stable board (Hyperlite Landlock) and my fast, fun board (Triple X, custom Thrasher). I had a friend with me who had never surfed and he was able to go ropeless on the second set (on the Landlock) so I am taking that as a good sign for the wave. I have not tested the port side wave as me, my daughter and my friend all rode goofy. Hopefully, I will be testing that side in the next two weeks.

                          New setup:

                          Up front - 400 lbs (combination of sacs and lighter people - evenly weighted)
                          Back - 800 lbs
                          Side - 325 (combination) - 150 of that in the far back corner, surfside (this was key)

                          Amazing that a 20 foot DD could throw such a good wave with just over 1500 lbs of weight. Very impressed with the Nautique engineers! -Marc

                          Comment

                          • wakeboarder3780
                            • Jan 2013
                            • 66

                            • SC


                            #14
                            Not sure if you're still in prototyping mode but if you are perhaps consider a cordless jig saw / reciprocal saw. You could start with an oversized board and try out a lot of different shapes all in one night. Obviously if you don't have one it would increase your cost but something to think about. I like the mentality. I'm trying to think of a way to get it more easily removed and re-installed. A square coupler pin comes to mind if you could move your attachment points to the side of the swim deck only. Would also be safer for someones feet but not really a big deal. Any plans to weld one out of aluminum after you're done prototyping?

                            Comment

                            • High altitude
                              • Oct 2011
                              • 206

                              • Larkspur, CO

                              • 2014 SN 200 OB

                              #15
                              Already on the cordless recip saw program. I make the mods right down at my dock. My biggest problem is that I usually am too busy having fun! I get a wave that I like and all I want to do is surf! Added to that "problem" is that I'm putting our slalom course in this week. That's just another distraction, as I find those darn balls so addictive.

                              I swear I will take pics this weekend. I probably will try a few more subtle changes but it's hard to believe I can get the wave much better. If I get the same results on the port side I will be ecstatic. I couldn't believe how stoked I was with the goofy wave I surfed over the weekend.

                              As for a more permanent solution, I have been think about that as well. Right now it is very simple and extremely cost effective. If I knew I could change sides on the fly, I would add the Lenco's and a controller and have a system just like the NSS. Since I can't... I will probably fab a plate out of aluminum or stainless steel and try make a slightly cleaner attachment for the swim deck. I'm not too worried about safety because the NSS is on the opposite side and I can't conceive of how anybody would end up on that side when surfing. (maybe doing a dry start?) With that said, a cleaner look would also lend itself to a safer setup, and I am always for that. -Marc

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X