99 Air, Extra Batteries Placement, Custom Ballast...

[Mikeski]

Ballast/Batteries/Charging

Hi all,

About 2 years ago Grant removed his rear storage tanks and installed 4 sealed AGM batteries in the rear of his boat. He rebuilt the floor and uses sacs when needed (not often as he usually has enough boat babes piled in back to build the wake...). There are pictures of the tranfsormation posted here or on wakeworld, I will see if I can find the link.

For battery charging, I prefer a combiner over an isolator. It simply does what it needs to a little better than a combiner. Search for Yandina C150, I will attach the wiring diagram.

[Chexi]

RE: Ballast/Batteries/Charging

Mikeski, By your diagram I assume that you meant to say in your second to last sentence, "It [the combiner] simply does what it needs to do a little better than [an isolator]," correct?

[jaybird]

Isolator/Combiner

I think the terminology may be getting confused here.
I have seen an "isolator/combiner".
I have seen a manual "combiner".
I have never seen just an isolator.

Many time they are called charging relays.

If it can isolate it can also combine. The whole point is to automatically combine when a charging source is present and to isolate the starter battery when a load is pulling down the accessories battery, thus you always have a battery to start.

Here is a charging relay (combiner/isolator) with no battery switch.

[jaybird]

charging relay

Here is my chraging relay with a manual switch to combine for emergency starting.

[Mikeski]

RE: charging relay

I prefer the combiner over the isolator. There is too much voltage drop across an isolator, the combiner provides the full charge voltage to the battery and stereo system.

Jaybird, it looks like our systems are electrically identical?

Since my second battery bank only powers the stereo and lighting system I only want it combined to the main system when it is in charging. The combiner works in this manner providing fully automatic operation and priority charging to the starting battery. The combiner does not engauge until the charge state of the starting battery exceeds 13.3V, this prevents combining a dead battery bank with the starting battery.

[jaybird]

RE: charging relay

The BLUESEA charging relay combines based on time and voltage not only voltage. It will also open high over 16 volts to prevent battery damage if the alternator malfunctions. For example if source is 13 volts for more than 2 minuts it will close or if source 13.6 for 30 seconds it will close. The dead band prevents unessary cycling from open to close whcih would wear out contacts.
Here is how mine operates.
Relay Contact Position: Combine high 13.6 Volts over 30 sec.
Relay Contact Position: Combine high 13.0 Volts over 2 min.
Relay Contact Position: Open Low 12.35 Volts over 10 sec.
Relay Contact Position: Open Low 12.75 Volts over 30 sec.
Relay Contact Position - Open High 16.0 Volts@12 Volt
Its really simple, close high to charge both and opens low to prevent draing the starter battery. They work great, would not have a duel battery system without it.

[Chexi]

RE: charging relay

Well... I checked my alternator today and it is a marine alternator. The only markings I could find without removing it were on the back and it said, "Marine SAE J1171". Well I thought that was a model number, but J1171 is just the protocol designation for marine approved. So I still don't know the size, but it looks like a Delco and an educated guess is 50 - 65 amps max. The wiring harness is definitely not 4 gauge wire. Here's a picture.

Oh, and for some fun, here is a picture of my disintegrated blower hose too.

[Chexi]

RE: charging relay

Oh, I ordered the Blue Seas combiner/isolator and will be installing that soon. I guess the 100amp alternator kit is my next major purchase.

[jaybird]

RE: charging relay

The orange wire is looks to be the old standard 10 Gauge used with 45 maps alternators.

[WIKD281]

Yes, mine is the Blue/Black one. I absolutely love the color scheme. I also much prefer these graphics to the smaller "AIR" symbol that followed it in later years. It contains the perfect mix of understatment and flash. Even with the interior vinyl in really bad shape, I get a ton of complements on the look of my boat. Last season I had a guy with a new MC X1 (the old X-star hull) gush over my boat. It was great having someone with a brand new very nice boat keep staring at my boat and finally come over and ask me about it. It didn't have the heart to tell him that I paid only $14k for it.

Here is a pic. It's the best I can do at the moment. I have replaced that rack with 2 sets of flight clips. I have also added a 3rd traditional rack from bulletlines on the round cross bar below, so I can hold up to 6 wakeboard/skates now. I might add a 4th rack for a wakesurfer as well.

Chexi- nice boat! Its crazy for me to say, but I was the original owner. I had the original stereo system installed at car stereo installations unlimited in Newark, Ca.
Is the boat now in Texas? A friend of mine used to tell me a few years ago that he used to see this boat parked in someones driveway in San Jose, Ca. I saw that there were some texas CF numbers on it, was that before you bought it? I cant say what consists of the stereo now, as im sure its been changed many times before. If you have any questions please feel free to ask. I still have the original radio from that boat! It was a clarion white faced Tape player. haha!
Harold.

[Chexi]

WIKD281

I bought the boat from someone who kept it at Lake Tahoe. I brought it to Texas late last summer. Motor runs great and the pull is super smooth, but the rest needs some TLC. I'm in the process of restoring it. This site is a godsend for that.

I just pulled the subs and cleaned them up. I've got some new grills on the way and should have them next week. I'm going to rip off the carpet from the box and epoxy the MDF and re-carpet. I have to read up on custom subs, but I might put in 2 port/vent holes, but if I do that, I have to epoxy the insides too, so I hope that I don't need to.

I'm making a new mini-kickplate for the heater vents. I used the template that was in there, but I want something sturdier. 3/4" plywood covered in epoxy and carpeted should do the trick.

I've also ordered a completely new set of vinyl skins from Nautiqueskins.com. I'm thinking about replacing the carpet, but I want to try to clean it first. It's not that bad.

The last head unit was a pioneer installed by the last owner. It was less than a year old, but corroded pretty bad, wouldn't eject a CD, and would pop in and out. I replaced it with a Clarion M475 about 2 months ago... just before the new Alpine's came out that everyone is raving about. Oh well...

I'm thinking about adding a Wetsounds WS-420 EQ to gain full fade control of the tower vs the in cabin speakers. If I get it, I'm building a custom box to go to the right of the driver's seat to put it in. I'll also add a 4th in-cabin speaker then to balance out the somewhat odd 3-speaker configuration that come standard.

I pulled out the false floor you had built in the back storage locker. I'm going to relocate the deep cycle batteries to the bow. I may need to get optimas, due to their smaller size to do it, but I want the back storage locker for storage and/or more ballast. I am building a new false floor using your old one as a template. It's seen better days. I'm using 3/4" plywood. I"ll epoxy the entire piece and carpet it. I have a picture below of the piece. I put in 4 holes and attached two rope handles. The worked awesome when I tried it out for fitting today. Very easy to lift in and out with the handles. I had to shave off a bit, but it was really close. I figure that I will support it with epoxy-covered wood support structures below to keep it about 1/2" - 1" above the current ballast tanks. I might rip them out at some point and put in bags and run a system to the ski locker, but that is probably a 2010 project.

So did you ride for a team or something? There is the word "OWAKIN.COM" on the back (toward the front of the boat) tower speakers. I figured it was probably a team rider's boat back when it was new. I figure that is probably the only way you could positively ID the boat with certainty. I'd love to hear some of the history of the boat. You can PM it to me so we don't bore the rest of the planetnautique world.

I do have a few questions.

1. I tried out the ballast pump today, but it only seemed to run when I set it to empty. Is it supposed to be a 2-way ballast puppy style that will fill and empty, or is it a 1-way pump? The switch would indicate 2-ways, so I'm thinking that there is a loose wire.

2. Did you ever try to run the in-cabin speakers off the Alpine amps instead of the head unit? I plan on doing that. I'm also putting in new speakers when I get the vinyl skins.

[WIKD281]

hmmm. not sure about the ballast pump because I owned it soo long ago. I owned the boat from when it had .5 hour on it to when I sold it in 2002? I think that year is correct, may have been 2003? That was the way that I recogniezed the boat, by the gowakin.com sticker that was on the tower box. It was a local wakeboarding group here in the bay area, ca. that was started probably back in 1999 and lasted a few years before fizzling out. Was fun while it lasted! When I had the boat it had hifonics and rockford fosgate. What 12" subs are in there now? I originally had the round 12" kicker solo baric subs which were ok for the amount of space they were in.
If you were going to re-do the subbass I would recommend putting 1-12" sub below teh drivers dash/footwell area and put the other 12" sub under the passenger/clam shell area. I do agree that getting rid of the trojan 105's and putting in some optimas would be a good idea.
Sorry I couldnt remember more about the boat to give you more info.....but its been a long time. I know that I sold it to a guy in morgan hill who shortly after sold it to a guy in san jose. I guess then it went up to tahoe and now out to texas? wow.
Craziness!
Great to talk to you. Take it easy,
Harold.

[Quinner]

Scott,

The factory setup on my 99' was (2) pumps, one pump was for fill and the other was for empty. One pump was on the port side just below the engine, the other was in the rear bilge below the removable floor section. I want to say there is also a fuse(s) after the switch, cannot remember if it is behind the throttle control or under the dash. The factory installed pumps only lasted about 2-3 seasons.

[Chexi]

Thanks Quinner. As always, you are a huge help. I'll look when I go down this weekend. I'll take some pictures too, just in case. It sounds like I probably need to replace the fill pump. Since the empty pump makes noise, it does not sound like the fuse is blown, unless there are separate fuses for each. Easy way to check i guess, just fine them and look.