New Stereo for G23/G25

[EarmarkMarine]

Lee,
There is absolutely no technical reason that a really good quality and true infinite baffle subwoofer can't sound outstanding up to a certain limit provided the execution is right. And.....I so rarely see the execution done right. There is the typical difference-maker when it comes to IB.
However, having said that, you may be correct in that you will not be satisfied with any IB 10-inch sub coming from where you have been.
The limiting factor with an IB sub is that it is mostly self-sufficient in controlling and damping the woofer that is violently changing directions 100 times a second to reproduce 50 Hz at a considerable excursion/output. That is alot of interia to control with something that has the mass of a subwoofer. No mass=no deep bass. No mass=no cone rigidity. Etc. So an IB can be effective up to a point. But when you pass the excursion threshold you need the more linear control of 'air suspension', in other words the spring of trapped air in a sealed box or resonant chamber (bass-reflex).

David

[santelee]

david, thx for your response. With the JL audio M series are u literally just replacing the sub w/o modification to the box? If so what amp are you using to power the sub?

[EarmarkMarine]

Lee,
I'm strictly referring to those applications where Nautique places the sub in the starboard coaming (not the bolster panel but into thick and solid figerglass) just outside and below the driver's hip. In this case there is no enclosure but just the open gunnel cavity. If the gunnel cavity is well isolated front to rear by a good distance, then this is well suited for a real IB woofer. This may require a depth-reducing ring to clear the hull for the deeper JL. No big deal.
For the JL Audio IB M series we like to see 250 to 300 watts of honest power according to 14.4 volt CEA2006 ratings into a 4-ohm load. The new JL Audio JX 500.1 Class D at 340 watts into 4-ohms works perfectly.
From there it's knowing how to set up, crossover and tune an IB woofer differently from an enclosed sub.

David

[santelee]

laketexoma, ur putting subs in rear lockers? like beside the engines? or under the seats on the side?

[Laketexoma]

on each side of the engine. I'll be cutting part of the rear starboard so they vent ino the engine area. The piece that is non-removable is what I will remove. I'm probably going to lay fiberglass in the rear to mold to the boat so I can get the most air space. Lots of tape and plastic and a few hours of work. lol The box will be 19w 15-10d and between 16-20 tall, just depends. I dont want it to cover the access ports to the bags so when the NSS comes in I dont have to pull subs for them to work there.

[EarmarkMarine]

Using the storage compartments to each side of the engine compartment is okay if you have the leverage of a couple of 12s, 13.5s or 15s and tons of power to have enough leverage to overcome the acoustic obstacles. And it may be fine when the hatches are up as you are listening at rest.
There are challenges though.
When underway at speed, subs that are decidedly behind you are harder to hear. Kind of like rear deck speakers in a convertible car. As a result the amplifier and subs have to work four to ten times harder to have the same impact. Eventually this can have reliability implications not to mention that the product that operates the most below its maximum capacity to produce the same results sounds the best.
Usually the sub location is somewhat centered between four coaxial midbass drivers so there is a decent transition and coherency through the bi-amped crossover region. But with a sub to the extreme rear its really hard to have any phase coherency and you usually have a hole in the midbass response, not to mention a loss of bass tonal construction.
The rear bulkhead and engine compartment hatches are constructed to specifically attenuate engine noise. Big woofers in big numbers with big power can punch through with some boat shakin', boom, thump, hit and rumble. But the articulate bass qualities, attack and transients are seriously muted.
Personally, I like to take advantage of a direct-radiating subwoofer that is low in the boat so it can benefit from the surrounding sole and coaming surfaces as reinforcing planes and boundaries. I want my sub down in the bathtub, so to speak, with me. Bass, especially as you go deeper, in an open field environment disspipates so radiply (more like flash evaporation) as compared to a home or vehicle. I would rather have less sub surface area and not have to overcome all the obstacles according to my listening priorities.
Having said that, keep in mind that different boaters use their audio systems in different ways, with completely different expectations. A couple of big woofers in the rear lockers may or may not fit your objectives. There isn't much risk or time invested in running the wires back there and dropping in a couple of pre-packaged automotive sub/enclosures to get a feel for it.

David

[WakeNSurf]

Have read existing stereo is pretty sub par. If ordering new boat, what is a reasonable amount to budget for re-do of existing system? Anyone done this? If so, give me idea of what your system looks like and rough cost. Probably want 1 set of tower speakers assuming that is "good enough". Can any part of existing system be used with good results?

Thanks.

jrz1,

Call Wave Noize they are right beside Race City Marine. They are doing the stereo in my G23.

[jrz1]

Weezy did the tower speakers on my existing boat and I already pinged him on this. May try to go see the G23 he does for the Charlotte boat show but I'm having ACL surgery Monday so I may still be in couch potato mode. We'll see.....

[Laketexoma]

Everyone has different taste. I like not giving up a ton of space in the front of the boat. I'm 38 so having huge bass is not that big of a deal. Now when I was 16 and had a ford ranger walled off with 6 15's I cared more about it. 2L7's and a kicker 2500.1 is fine with me. As long as I'm happy with it that's all that matters.

[santelee]

The G23 has a fiberglass sealed (I think) box for the sub. I was crawling under seat yesterdat. Anybody have the volume of this encloser? I've seen some replace wet sound 10 inch sub.

[Laketexoma]

It is not sealed. It is open to the under bow sack area.

[santelee]

thx laketexoma, seems like the only design flaw on boat lol. wish could delete from order entirely

[WakeNSurf]

Weezy did the tower speakers on my existing boat and I already pinged him on this. May try to go see the G23 he does for the Charlotte boat show but I'm having ACL surgery Monday so I may still be in couch potato mode. We'll see.....

Gotcha. Yea I talked to Weezy today and he was working on the G23 for the Charlotte boat show. Hope everything goes well with your surgery and recovery.

[jrz1]

Turns out the Dr. decided not to rebuild ACL so it was just scope to clean up cartilage. Already walking around and spent day at kart track with my kids. Looking forward to hitting boat show next weekend and will check out what Weez did with the G23. I ordered the G25 and it should be here late March/early April so have some time to figure it out.

[perry386]

on each side of the engine. I'll be cutting part of the rear starboard so they vent ino the engine area. The piece that is non-removable is what I will remove. I'm probably going to lay fiberglass in the rear to mold to the boat so I can get the most air space. Lots of tape and plastic and a few hours of work. lol The box will be 19w 15-10d and between 16-20 tall, just depends. I dont want it to cover the access ports to the bags so when the NSS comes in I dont have to pull subs for them to work there.

Please post pics when you are done because that sounds like, if done correctly, that could sound AWESOME; really clean and deep I expect, without so much of a modulated rumble as some of the subs I have heard.